The Design Of Business | The Business of Design

Hosted by Design Observer

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Episodes

168

Latest episode

Oct 2026

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EN-US

About the show

The Design of Business | The Business of Design explores how design shapes, and is shaped by, the world around us. Hosted by Ellen McGirt, the podcast features conversations with visionary leaders from a wide range of industries, from architecture and technology to journalism and retail. Together, they examine creative practices, challenge conventional thinking, and explore how design drives business, innovation, and social change. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground.

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October 6, 2026Episode 936 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Eric Ries Would Like to Apologize

In 2011 Eric Ries published a book called The Lean Startup . It sold over one million copies and became something of a Bible for the Silicon Valley set. And Eric himself became something of a prophet. The Lean Startup gave a generation of founders a methodology to build quickly, scale quickly, and build value quickly. Eric encouraged his readers to build businesses to change the world. He forgot to say for the better. And many readers took his omission seriously. The companies The Lean Startup birthed kept going bad. 15 years later, Eric is back with a new book. It’s called Incorruptible . It is a sequel, an apology and a correction. In it, Eric offers a blueprint for how to design a profitable company that still has a soul. Eric joined DB|BD host Ellen McGirt live onstage at the Aspen Business and Society Summit to talk about his personal and professional journey to writing Incorruptible. It’s a story filled with emotion and metaphors and praise for companies who are really getting it right (shoutout to Costco). On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript.

October 6, 2026Episode 833 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Proactivity is the Key to Survival With Edelman’s Dave Fleet

Dave Fleet sees more corporate crises in a month than many executives see in their entire career. He is the Managing Director and the Head of Global Crisis at Edelman, meaning he helps companies prepare for, and manage through, crises. He is regularly fielding phone calls from people on the worst day of their careers.But his job is also more than that, Dave and his team are fighting disinformation, teaching media literacy and helping businesses proactively build trust with their employees and clients. In this conversation with DB|BD host Ellen McGirt, Dave explains why, in a world that is permanently in crisis, a company’s reputation is its best defense. He also explains why he stresses the importance of coalition building with his clients and why empathy has a commercial business interest. Dave also explains why in a world where trust is local and volatility is permanent, raising media literacy and fighting disinformation is essential. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript.

September 29, 2026Episode 734 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Motivating People is a Design Challenge with Deloitte’s Steve Goldbach

Steve Goldbach leads Deloitte’s Sustainability and Infrastructure practice. He believes today's leaders face an emerging new design challenge: figuring out how the next generation will build real judgment and taste when AI is taking over so much of the work that used to teach it. He's the co-author, along with his longtime collaborator Geoff Tuff, of three best-selling books on leadership and innovation. His latest is called Hone: How Purposeful Leaders Defy Drift. In this conversation with DB|BD host Ellen McGirt, Steve explains that a business’ culture is a collective outcome of the behavior of people in it and why motivating people to change those behaviors is the ultimate design challenge. He also shares his research on making a business case for sustainability and explains why preparing for an organization’s future lies in the experience of their youngest employees in mind On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript. Make the Business Case from Your Sustainability Initiative from the Harvard Business Review Steve’s latest book, Hone

September 29, 2026Episode 645 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Innovation Requires Collaboration with Professor Linda Hill

No one has better insight on what it takes to lead across space and time than Linda Hill. She has been a professor at Harvard Business School for forty years. Her current title is the Wallace Brett Donham Professor of Business Administration and Faculty Chair of the Leadership Initiative. She’s also started two companies of her own and co-authored three books about leadership. The latest is called Genius at Scale . It’s a guide for leaders on mastering the practice of innovation in a tumultuous time of change using innovative companies like Pixar and Pfizer as case studies. In this conversation with DB|BD host Ellen McGirt, Linda shares the things that all innovative companies practice, even those with radically different functions: they treat their employees decently, they kill ideas that aren’t working and they don’t see genius as a collaborative venture. She also shares her own experience as an entrepreneur and explains why one of the biggest problems with AI is that we are wayfinding and pathfinding at the same time. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript. Genius at Scale

September 22, 2026Episode 535 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Dean Erika James Says a Prepared Leader is a Disciplined One

Erika James became the dean of the Wharton School on July 1, 2020. So she knows a thing or two about leading during a crisis. She even wrote a book about it. Dean James, and her co-author Lynn Perry Wooten, published The Prepared Leader in the fall of 2022. The book breaks down the phases of crisis management and lends some advice on how to make big decisions under pressure. In this conversation with DB|BD host Ellen McGirt, Dean James explains why leading in a crisis-filled world requires discipline. She also details the decisions Wharton is making to prepare its students and her faculty to succeed in an unstable economy that is increasingly reliant on AI. They also chat about the state of DEI and Dean James’ ambivalent thoughts on being the first Black person to serve as Wharton’s dean. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript. The Prepared Leader

September 22, 2026Episode 437 min

DB|BD at Aspen: AI is the Greatest Civil Rights Issue of Our Time With Chris Hyams

Chris Hyams spent 15 years at the job search platform Indeed, becoming its CEO in 2019. When he stepped down in 2025, more than 300 million jobseekers visited Indeed’s site every month. He also 200x’d the company’s revenue. So why would a guy who is so good at what he does step down? According to him, he had a higher calling. Chris believes that AI is the single greatest civil rights issue of our time and he’s appalled it isn’t better regulated. And he’s taking action. Chris is teaching a college course on responsible AI and he’s also Founding Board Member of the Guardrails Alliance, a Super-PAC that was created to fight ANOTHER Super PAC that has invested more than $140 million dollars in snuffing out anti-AI congressional candidates. In this conversation with DB|BD host Ellen McGirt, Chris explains why he is so worried about the unfettered growth of AI. He openly questions the claims made by OpenAI, Anthropic and others who stand to profit from AI. Oh, and he has the data to back it up. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript. The Guardrails Alliance

September 17, 202633 min

DB|BD Presents: Draw the Line

DB|BD is proud to introduce Design Observer's latest podcast: Draw the Line, the inside story of Louisiana’s fight over power, maps, and who gets left off them. Because every district line is a design decision — and every decision is about who gets power. The Supreme Court case Louisiana v. Callais gutted the Voting Rights Act and rewrote the rules of American democracy. As goes Louisiana, so goes the rest of the country. Who's fighting for your vote? This is episode one. In it, host Ellen McGirt travels to Baton Rouge to meet the organizers, legal experts, and everyday citizens on the front lines of the fight against gerrymandering and traces how a dispute over one congressional district became a battle for the future of American democracy. Subscribe to Draw the Line on Apple and Spotify and visit our site for more info. Episodes releasing throughout Fall 2026.

September 15, 2026Episode 346 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Judy Samuelson is Still Thinking About the Purpose of a Corporation

If you’re in the business world, you’ve heard of Judy Samuelson. Even if you’re not in the business world, you may have heard of Judy Samuelson. That’s because Judy is one of the most influential voices thinking about and wrestling with the purpose of business in the modern world and how capitalism can be a force for good. Judy founded the Aspen Institute’s Business and Society Program back in 1998. But perhaps one of her most important contributions is her leadership in the Business Roundtable’s 2019 decision to change the nature of a corporation from a singular focus on shareholders, to a broader stakeholder focus. In this conversation with DB|BD host Ellen McGirt, Judy reflects on what impact the statement had and if it is even still relevant. She also tells some stories about what it was like to gather with some of the business world’s most powerful leaders to try and define that stubborn thing called the corporation. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript. Scene on Radio’s Capitalism Series Business Roundtable’s 2019 Statement

September 15, 2026Episode 243 min

DB|BD at Aspen: Todd Breyfogle on the Aspen Institute’s Humanistic History

In 1949, Walter and Elizabeth Paepkes invited 2,000 artists, thinkers and business leaders to the abandoned mining town of Aspen, Colorado, for the first iteration of an Aspen Institute gathering. Eight decades later, artists, thinkers and business leaders still convene in Aspen every summer to discuss the challenges and advances shaping our world. And while their modes of transportation have changed (that first group mostly arrived via horseback), they share a key belief with their predecessors: that a deep investment in literature, philosophy and the arts is the key to nurturing our human spirits. Today’s guest is a sort of guardian of that legacy. Todd Breyfogle is the Aspen Institute’s Senior Advisor for Humanistic Studies and Practices. He chronicles the story of Aspen’s dedication to the humanities. And keeps it alive. In this episode of DB|BD, Todd talks with host Ellen McGirt about why Aspen’s radical, artistic roots are a key that unlocks a better way of thinking about what they do now and how we can all do more meaningful work, together. On this season of DB|BD, we are thinking about radical collaboration. Host Ellen McGirt sat down with visionary designers, leaders and thinkers at the 2026 Aspen Business & Society Summit to ask them about the radical act of collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript.

September 15, 2026Episode 131 min

AI, Radical Collaboration & Hope: DB|BD Returns to the Aspen Business and Society Summit

Listeners, it has been a while, but DB|BD is back! And this season we are thinking about radical collaboration. For the second year in a row, Design Observer is publishing some exclusive conversations from the Aspen Institute's Business and Society Summit. In July, DBBD host Ellen McGirt interviewed eight thoughtful, important and provocative leaders who are thinking deeply about AI, sustainability, and the role of business in a chaotic world. But before you dive into the interviews, we are giving you some context. Design Observer audio producer Alexis Haut joins Ellen to chat about the big themes and impressions coming out of this year’s conference including: how people are feeling about the AI shift and why, against all odds, people are feeling a little more hopeful than they were this time last year. They are also thinking about something that is very important to us here at Design Observer: collaborating with others in a time when it often feels impossible to find common ground. We will be publishing two of these interviews every Tuesday for the next month, starting today. Visit our site for more on this episode and to view a transcript.