Without the Bank Podcast

Hosted by Mary Jo Irmen

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273

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Jun 2026

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About the show

The archaic system of giving up money today, taking on risk, and hoping to retire is B.S. This podcast seeks to help make you responsible for your money and your future. You are the one who cares more about it than anyone else. I am here to help you and provide the honesty you need. No sugar coating. No false claims. Just straight up truth.

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June 11, 202622 min

The Dangerous Question Your Financial Agent Is Ignoring (Ep. 273)

The expertise of your financial advisor is paramount. A truly effective advisor asks insightful questions about your entire financial management journey, including your generational wealth planning. They should act as a coach, guiding you on how to create consistent cash flow and implement sound wealth building strategies for the long term. This personalized financial planning approach is key to securing your family's future. Stop worrying about policy splits and company brands. Your agent is what actually matters. Mary Jo and Trissa break down why these debates are a distraction — and why the single most important decision you'll make is who you choose as your agent. In this episode, we cover: • Why policy structure debates are missing the point • Whole life vs universal life: what actually matters • The Toyota/Honda analogy — and why how you drive beats what you drive • Why One America works for farmers and blue collar families • The widow story that proves why proper coverage matters • How to spot an agent who will actually coach you 👉 Subscribe here: https://www.youtube.com/@MaryJoIrmen?sub_confirmation=1 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book ⏱ Chapters 00:00 — Intro: What really matters in infinite banking 01:13 — Why policy splits (10/90, 60/40) don't matter 04:14 — The best policy is the one you get started 06:03 — Whole life vs universal life explained 08:24 — Toyota vs Honda: why company brand isn't everything 10:50 — Why One America fits farmers & blue collar 14:28 — How you drive matters more than what you drive 16:30 — The widow story: why proper coverage matters 18:35 — Stop shopping for insurance — shop for the agent 21:10 — Don't just read — implement 22:42 — Final takeaway: find your coach Link Mentioned: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book

June 4, 202616 min

It Sounds Like Free Money... But Is It? (Ep. 272)

Is your 401k employer match really free money? We break down how the match actually works and what nobody tells you. We're diving into the critical topic of retirement planning, specifically addressing the volatility of investments like 401ks. If you're concerned about market dips impacting your retirement savings, we explore alternative strategies. It's about ensuring your financial planning prioritizes accessibility and security for your future and your family, considering options beyond traditional investing. 👉 Find more Without the Bank here: https://www.youtube.com/@MaryJoIrmen?sub_confirmation=1 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book Welcome to the fifth and final installment in our 401k Half-Truths series. Today we're pulling back the curtain on the employer match — how it really works, what you're actually getting, and whether that "free money" is worth locking up your cash until age 59½ (or 73 for RMDs). We cover: • How automatic 401k enrollment quietly traps employees • The real math behind employer matching (100% up to 6% isn't what you think) • What to ask your employer instead of the 401k match • The "bucket with holes" analogy — why your finances keep leaking • The 4 bases of financial flow (home base = your policy) • Why the match often gets eaten by management fees anyway • Memory dividends vs. delayed life — the Die With Zero mindset Chapters 0:00 — A 401k Is Not Guaranteed 0:50 — Automatic Enrollment: My Husband's Story 3:00 — Ask for the Match as a Bonus Instead 4:15 — How Employer Matching Actually Works (The Math) 5:45 — The Bucket With Holes Analogy 7:30 — Becoming an Honest Banker 10:14 — The 4 Bases of Financial Flow 13:30 — Die With Zero & Memory Dividends 15:15 — Make a Strategy Appointment 📖 Mentioned in this episode: Die With Zero by Bill Perkins Becoming Your Own Banker by Nelson Nash 📞 Ready to take control? Read the book & schedule a strategy appointment and let's find out if a policy makes sense for you. 👉 https://www.withoutthebank.com/book 🔔 Subscribe for more episodes on living without the bank, infinite banking, and financial freedom.

May 28, 202613 min

The 401k Deal Nobody Would Take | Average vs Actual Returns (Ep. 271)

Your 401k says 25% average return — but your actual return could be zero. Here's the math. 👉 Find more Without the Bank here: https://www.youtube.com/@MaryJoIrmen?sub_confirmation=1 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book Part 4 of the 401k Half-Truths series breaks down the biggest illusion in retirement planning: average vs actual returns. You've probably heard your 401k grows "5-10% on average" — but that number hides a painful truth. Tarisa walks through a real math example that shows how a 25% average return can equal a 0% actual return, shares her own mom's experience of having less in her 401k than she contributed, and poses a simple question: would you take a deal where someone tells you how much to give them, charges you fees even when they lose your money, locks your money away, and penalizes you for needing it early? That's essentially what a 401k is. If you're contributing the max to your 401k, you need to understand the difference between inputs and outputs — how much you've actually put in versus what you can actually access. There are alternatives that aren't subject to market risk. This episode is about empowering you with information to make better decisions for your future. ⏱️ Chapters 0:00 - The Problem with 401k "Average Returns" 0:42 - 401k Half-Truths Part 4: Average vs Actual 1:30 - The 25% Average, 0% Actual Math Example 3:47 - My Mom's 401k Story 5:15 - How Losses Destroy Growth 6:30 - Global Economy Risk: Tariffs & Inflation 7:47 - Why Actual Return Matters More Than Average 8:50 - The 401k Deal Nobody Would Take 10:14 - Inputs vs Outputs: Audit Your 401k 11:35 - Seed vs Harvest: The Tax Trap 12:03 - Simulate Your Portfolio's Past Performance 12:34 - Guaranteed Alternatives & Final Thoughts #personalfinance #retirementplanning #retirement #compoundinterest #401k 📘 Books Mentioned: → Life Without the Bank → Becoming Your Own Banker by Nelson Nash 👉 Get them here: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book 📧 Questions? Reach us at maryjo@withoutthebank.com or tarisa@withoutthebank.com 🌐 Learn more at http://www.withoutthebank.com

May 21, 202617 min

Your Spouse Dies — Now What? The Life Insurance Gap Nobody Warns You About (Ep. 270)

What happens to your family the day you're gone — not financially, but humanly? 👉 Follow Mary Jo Here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXYvzroUouEMsTGKFw5nJHQ 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book In this episode, I share what I learned after delivering my first death claim, and after seeing what widows are saying on social media about the reality of losing a spouse. "Widow brain" is real — the brain fog, the inability to concentrate, the struggle to return to work. FMLA may only give you 3 days to grieve. And that $100,000 life insurance policy? It might not even cover two years of bills. So, how much life insurance do you need? Whether you can afford whole life or only term right now — get enough life insurance to give your family at least two years of cash flow. Two years to grieve. Two years to figure it out. Two years without having to sell the house or go back to work before they're ready.This episode is a wake-up call for anyone who's been putting off life insurance or lowballing their death benefit. Don't wait until it's too late. 0:30 – The "TikTok Algorithm of Widows" — what I learned 1:30 – FMLA and the 3-day grieving reality 3:00 – "Widow Brain" — why surviving spouses can't just go back to work 4:00 – How adequate life insurance lets widows quit and mourn 5:00 – My first death claim changed my perspective 7:00 – "She doesn't need much coverage" — why that's dead wrong 8:30 – FMLA limitations and employer compassion gaps 10:00 – How a parent's death affects children's grieving 11:00 – Why $100K isn't enough — you need 2 years of cash flow 12:00 – Only 2 out of 75 widows mentioned life insurance 13:00 – It's about priorities, not affordability 13:30 – A friend's tragic story: widowed at 31 16:00 – Why spouses need to be involved in the finances 17:00 – Final call: the death benefit matters as much as cash value 📘 Books Mentioned: → Life Without the Bank → Becoming Your Own Banker by Nelson Nash 👉 Get them here: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book 📧 Questions? Reach us at maryjo@withoutthebank.com 🌐 Learn more at http://www.withoutthebank.com

May 14, 202621 min

Why the Wealthy Never Stop Buying Life Insurance (Ep. 269)

Paul Atkins owns 54 life insurance policies — and it reveals everything financial gurus miss. 👉 Follow Mary Jo Here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXYvzroUouEMsTGKFw5nJHQ The SEC Chairman's financial disclosure shocked professors at Florida State, Illinois State, and the University of Georgia. But for anyone who understands permanent life insurance, it made perfect sense. In Episode 269 of Without the Bank, we break down exactly what the "experts" got wrong — and what Paul Atkins, the Rockefellers, and high-net-worth families have known for generations. 💡 Key Takeaways ✅ Why permanent life insurance is NOT just a death benefit ✅ How cash value grows tax-deferred and is accessed income-tax-free through loans ✅ How to use your policy as collateral while keeping your compound interest uninterrupted ✅ How life insurance is used for estate planning and generational wealth transfer ✅ Why the Infinite Banking Concept works — and why most financial media ignores it ✅ Why this strategy isn't just for the ultra-wealthy — it works for everyday people too Paul Atkins holds $32.7 million in life insurance — roughly 10% of his $327 million net worth. When financial professors call that "confusing," it tells you everything about the gap between credentialed advice and real wealth strategy. 🔖 Chapters 0:00 – Paul Atkins' 54 Life Insurance Policies 1:00 – Who Is Paul Atkins? 3:00 – What Financial Professors Got Wrong 5:00 – The Truth About Cash Value vs. Death Benefit 7:00 – Is Life Insurance Only for the Wealthy? 9:30 – Estate Planning & Advanced Strategies 12:00 – Life Insurance as a Liquidity Tool 14:00 – The Rockefeller Wealth Strategy 16:30 – Why the Media Gets It Wrong 18:00 – Why Nobody Teaches This 20:30 – What You Should Do Next 📘 Books Mentioned: → Life Without the Bank → Becoming Your Own Banker by Nelson Nash 👉 Get them here: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book 📧 Questions? Reach us at maryjo@withoutthebank.com 🌐 Learn more at http://www.withoutthebank.com

May 7, 202617 min

Your 401k Isn't as Accessible as You Think (Ep. 268)

The 401k access rules they never taught you — RMDs, hardship withdrawals, loans & hidden costs. 👉 More Without the Bank Here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXYvzroUouEMsTGKFw5nJHQ In this episode, Tarisa breaks down the third half-truth of 401k plans: access and distribution. The rules around when and how you can touch your own retirement money are far more restrictive than most people realize — and ignoring them could cost you thousands. In this episode: ✅ Required Minimum Distributions (RMDs) — why the government forces withdrawals at 73, even if you don't need the money ✅ Hardship Distributions — the only 5 qualifying events that avoid the 10% early withdrawal penalty ✅ 401k Loans — the repayment rules, what happens if you leave your job, and the hidden opportunity cost ✅ Inherited 401k — what your beneficiaries actually owe in taxes when they inherit your account ✅ Whole Life Insurance — how it offers uninterrupted compounding and flexible access as an alternative This is Part 3 of our series on the Top 5 Half-Truths of 401k. Don't miss it. 💡 Key Ideas 1. RMDs force withdrawals at 73 — ready or not. The IRS mandates distributions starting at age 73 to collect deferred taxes. Even if you don't need the money, you're required to take it — and it can push you into a higher tax bracket. 2. Only 5 events qualify for a penalty-free hardship distribution. Medical expenses, primary home purchase, eviction/foreclosure prevention, funeral costs, and primary residence repairs are the only IRS-approved exceptions to the 10% early withdrawal penalty. 3. 401k loans carry more risk than most people know. You can borrow up to $50,000, but if you leave your job, the balance may be due in as little as 60–90 days. Miss the deadline and it's reclassified as a taxable distribution — plus a 10% penalty. 4. The real cost of a 401k loan is the compounding you miss. Money borrowed from your account stops earning. It's not just the interest — it's the opportunity cost of interrupted growth over time. 5. Whole life insurance (especially when structured for Infinite Banking) lets your money work while you borrow. Unlike a 401k loan, policy loans use the insurance company's money — your cash value keeps earning uninterrupted compound interest the entire time. Chapters 0:00 - Introduction & Series Overview 1:33 - Required Minimum Distributions (RMDs) 2:34 - Hardship Distributions & Qualifying Events 3:30 - 401k Loans: Rules & Repayment 6:00 - The Hidden Opportunity Cost of 401k Loans 8:04 - Inherited 401k Tax Rules 8:35 - 401k Limitations Recap 12:30 - Whole Life Insurance as an Alternative 16:30 - Wrap-Up & Next Episode Preview 📅 Ready to build a strategy that actually works for you? 👉 Get the book here and schedule your call with Tarisa or Mary Jo → https://www.withoutthebank.com/book

April 30, 202620 min

Gross Income Is a Lie — Here's What to Ask Instead (Ep. 267)

Gross income is a sales pitch. Net income is the truth. Here are the questions you need to ask. 👉 Follow Mary Jo Here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXYvzroUouEMsTGKFw5nJHQ Everybody's talking about how much money you CAN make. Nobody's talking about how much you actually KEEP. Let's fix that. In this solo episode, Mary Jo breaks down the gross vs. net income trap that catches new and experienced business buyers alike. Using real-world examples — tote rental businesses, car washes, Jiffy Lube franchises, and Airbnb — she walks through the questions you MUST ask before you fall in love with a business opportunity. Here's what you'll learn: ✅ Why most business owners quote gross — and why it's almost meaningless ✅ The "un-fudged" net income question that reveals the real picture ✅ How to factor in owner draws, distributions, and personal expenses run through the business ✅ Why a $100K/year tote business might not be worth your time when you calculate the hourly rate ✅ What a car wash owner told MJ that instantly killed her interest ("it's like having milk cows") ✅ The difference between buying a job and building an asset If you're evaluating a business to buy, a side hustle, or a "passive income" opportunity — this episode is your due diligence checklist. 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book 🔔 Subscribe for new weekly episodes 👍 Share this video with someone you love 📧 Reach out with your questions or what you want to learn in future episodes Website: https://www.withoutthebank.com 💌 Email: maryjo@withoutthebank.com

April 23, 202625 min

Why Being Debt-Free Could Leave You Broke (And What To Do Instead) (Ep. 266)

Is debt-free the wrong goal? Discover how your life insurance policy works like your own bank. Most people spend their lives chasing "debt-free" — but what if that's the wrong goal entirely? Today MJ and Tarisa break down the infinite banking concept — showing you how a whole life insurance policy can work as your own personal bank. Route your money through your policy, borrow against it for everyday expenses, and let compound interest work for you around the clock — even while you're spending. In this episode, you'll learn: ✅ Why "debt-free" doesn't equal financial security — cash flow does ✅ The baseball analogy that rewires how you think about your money ✅ How policyholders end up $2 million ahead of the cash payer over a lifetime ✅ Real-life examples: vehicles, private school tuition, braces, sporting events ✅ Why your whole life policy is simpler to understand than your 401k ✅ How to stop fearing the "sales conversation" and start getting real answers 💬 "We either pay interest or we give up the ability to earn interest." — Nelson Nash 📖 Referenced: Becoming Your Own Banker by Nelson Nash ⏱️ Chapters 00:00 Introduction — Is "Debt-Free" Actually the Goal? 01:03 The Baseball Analogy: Your Policy as Home Base 02:41 Why People Struggle with "Premium" and "Loan Repayment" 05:28 Borrowing vs. Paying Cash: The Savings Account Comparison 06:28 Uninterrupted Compound Interest Explained 08:06 Funneling Everyday Expenses Through Your Policy 09:39 Why Most People Can't Wrap Their Head Around It 11:00 Redirecting Existing Loan Payments Into Your Policy 12:00 "Caught, Not Taught" — Real-Life Policy Examples 14:24 The Debt-Free Myth: Cash Flow Is King 15:34 Cash Payer vs. Policyholder — The $2 Million Outcome 16:56 Borrowing Wisely: What Loans Should Be For 18:00 Why the Policy Is Simpler Than a 401k 19:39 Overcoming the Fear of Being "Sold" 22:59 The "Before Asset" Concept & Next Steps 📅 Ready to see your own numbers? Get the books & schedule a strategy session → https://www.withoutthebank.com/book 💌 Email: tarisa@withoutthebank.com 💌 Email: maryjo@withoutthebank.com

April 16, 202618 min

Stop Wasting $168,000 on Youth Sports; Do This Instead (Ep. 265)

$168,000. Gone.That's what most parents spend on youth sports — no savings, no scholarship, no return. Are you spending $12,000 a year on your kids' sports — and have nothing to show for it? Most parents will drop $168,000 per child on activities, travel, and gear over 14 years — money that quietly disappears instead of building your retirement. In this episode of Without the Bank, I'm breaking down the strategy that changes everything: how to funnel your kids' activity spending through a whole life insurance policy so that money builds wealth instead of draining it. We cover: ➮ Why the "scholarship strategy" is a financial myth most parents fall for ➮ The exact numbers: how $12,000/year becomes $367,000 in cash value over 21 years ➮ Why the infinite banking concept beats a 529 plan for most families ➮ The hidden restrictions in 529 plans that financial advisors don't warn you about ➮ How to use this strategy to fund college, a car, or even your child's first business Your kids don't have to drain you. They can actually help you build. ⏱️ Chapters: 00:00 The $168,000 Problem No One Talks About 01:00 How the Math Actually Breaks Down 03:00 The Smarter Way to Fund Sports 04:00 Policy Numbers: $252K In, $367K Out 05:00 How Cash Value Grows Over Time 06:00 The Scholarship Myth (And What It Actually Costs) 07:00 What Youth Sports Are Doing to Your Retirement 09:00 Why 529 Plans Fall Short 11:00 Rethinking How You Use Your Money 12:00 The $900 Wrestling Tournament Story 13:00 Bad Coaches and What Sports Really Teach 14:00 Individual vs. Team Sports — A Different Take 15:00 Teaching Kids to Stand Up for Themselves 16:00 What If Your Kid Started a Business Instead? 17:00 How to Get Your Own Strategy 🔔 Subscribe for more honest conversations about personal finance, retirement planning, and financial education that the mainstream doesn't cover 📧 Reach out with your questions for future episodes Website: https://www.withoutthebank.com 💌 Email: tarisa@withoutthebank.com 💌 Email: maryjo@withoutthebank.com 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book

April 9, 202616 min

The 401k Tax Bomb Nobody is Talking About (Ep. 264)

Your 401k could lose over HALF its value before you retire — and nobody's telling you this. In Part 2 of our 401k Half-Truths series, we break down the one thing your financial advisor doesn't want you to think about: taxes you don't control yet. Here's the uncomfortable truth. The U.S. national debt just hit $39 trillion — that's roughly $114,000 owed per every American citizen. Someone has to pay that back. And if you're parking your retirement savings in a tax-deferred account like a 401k, you're betting your future on tax rates staying where they are. That's a gamble most people don't even know they're making. We walk through a real case study: Joe, 35, with $100K salary, $50K already saved, and 30 years to grow his 401k. On paper? A projected $3.2 million. After management fees? Down to $2 million. Add in future income taxes? He's actually looking at $1.3 million. That's not a typo — that's how much "tax-deferred" can cost you. 📌 We also cover: ➝ The difference between tax-deferred and tax-free (most people confuse them) ➝ Why the government incentivizes you to use a 401k — and who really benefits ➝ The history of income tax in America (it started as "temporary" in 1861) ➝ $48.1 trillion sitting in U.S. retirement plans — and what that means for lawmakers ➝ When a 401k actually does make sense for your situation ➝ Why access and control matter just as much as growth in retirement planning 💡 Are you on track for the retirement you actually want — or the one you were sold? ⏱️ Chapters 00:00 – The Tax Question Most People Ignore 01:00 – National Debt & What It Means for You 02:30 – The History of Income Tax 04:00 – What Tax-Deferred Really Means 05:30 – Breaking Down the 401(k) Example 07:00 – Fees + Taxes = Major Reduction 08:30 – Control, Access, and Flexibility 10:00 – Who a 401(k) Might Work For 12:00 – Real-Life Examples & Missed Opportunities 14:00 – Know the Rules Before You Play 🔔 Subscribe for more honest conversations about personal finance, retirement planning, and financial education that the mainstream doesn't cover 👍 Share this episode with someone relying on a 401(k) 📧 Reach out with your questions for future episodes Website: https://www.withoutthebank.com 💌 Email: tarisa@withoutthebank.com 💌 Email: maryjo@withoutthebank.com 👉 Get the book: https://www.withoutthebank.com/book