The Payments Experts Podcast

Hosted by Expert Payments Attorneys of Global Legal Law Firm

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110

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Jun 2026

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Expert payments attorneys discuss the electronic payments industry from a legal perspective.

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June 16, 2026Episode 11245 min

Five Things That Give The Merchant Processing Industry a Bad Name and How To Fix It | PEP112

Five things that give the merchant processing industry a bad name.A payment processing statement should never feel like a magic trick, yet too many merchants get hit with fees they never truly agreed to and increases they do not notice until the bank account hurts. Christopher Dryden and Jeremy Stock of Global Legal Law Firm bring on Mitchell Reisberg from Watchdog Merchant Services (https://watchdogmerchantservices.com/) to get blunt about the real-world problems small businesses face with merchant services: equipment leases that get “edited” after the fact, POS deals that look affordable until the long-term cost shows up, and processor tactics that rely on confusion and silence.Ever been pushed to “just sign here” on a POS or terminal lease? Hear how bad leasing tactics worked, why some still linger, and what honest payment partners do differently.• bogus terminal lease tactics and how they damage merchant trust• why POS leasing can make sense when terms are honest• embedded payments and processor changes that trigger massive effective rate increases• why merchants ignore statements and what that costs them• practical statement review habits and simple spreadsheet-based monitoring• why selling on price alone fails and how service reduces attrition• AI in sales and why automated outreach often falls flat• non-solicit confusion, residual disputes, and upstream channel risk• zombie billing, statement messages, and the 30-day window to fight back• arbitration clauses, liquidated damages, and auto-renewals that hit small businesses hardestWe unpack how hidden fees, statement message changes, PCI charges, and plain old rate creep can balloon a merchant’s effective rate over time, sometimes to shocking levels. Mitch explains why merchants often do not open their processing statements and how that creates the perfect conditions for “zombie billing,” where charges live on simply because nobody challenges them. We also talk about practical defense: basic statement review discipline, simple spreadsheet comparisons, and acting fast when a change hits because many contracts give only a short window to dispute or exit.AI bots made 3,500 calls and got zero bites. That says a lot about modern sales and merchant trust. We dig into what still works, plus the contract clauses that can trap you for years.From there, we zoom out to the systems that keep these issues alive: upstream contract terms, arbitration provisions that limit real recourse, liquidated damages that punish early termination, and auto-renewals that quietly extend bad relationships. We even get into the limits of AI for sales and operations, including why bots and automation can’t replace trust, clear communication, and someone who will actually pick up the phone and fix problems.Your effective rate can jump from 3% to 19% without you noticing if you never open your processing statements. We talk hidden fees, “zombie billing,” and how to fight back within 30 days. If you care about fair credit card processing fees, merchant advocacy, and payment contracts that don’t ambush small businesses, listen through and share it with someone who needs a statement reality check. Subscribe, leave a review, and tell us what fee or contract term you want us to break down next.**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

June 8, 2026Episode 11117 min

The AI Platform Helping Businesses Cut Costs Everywhere: Cost Savings | Bill Kurtzner PEP111

What if your invoices could tell you exactly where you’re overpaying? We talk agentic AI that audits spend, finds hard savings, and even unlocks wholesale pricing for SMBs. If you’ve ever looked at an invoice and wondered, “Am I paying a fair price, or am I just too busy to fight it?” you’ll feel this conversation in your bones. Christopher Dryden of Global Legal Law Firm sits down with Bill Kurtzner with Cost Savings (https://costsavings.com/), a payments veteran turned cost containment expert, to unpack how businesses quietly overpay across everyday categories like shipping, telecom, waste removal, utilities, bank fees, and even merchant processing fees and how a new wave of agentic AI is changing the math.Bill shares the path from door knocking as an ISO to building Util Auditors, then zooms in on the breakthrough: a granted patent for automated auditing and recommendation systems that turns manual invoice review into a scalable, self service workflow. We talk about the difference between “soft savings” (time saved) and hard cost savings you can actually measure on the bottom line, plus why that matters when you’re selling to SMB owners who need results, not vibes.We talk with Bill about turning expense and invoice data into measurable hard cost savings using a patent backed, agentic AI platform. We dig into how GPO pricing, payments partnerships, and SOC 2 security controls can make enterprise grade savings accessible to small businesses.• Bill’s background in payments and building credibility the hard way• Util Auditors and the shift from enterprise cost containment to scalable software• Agentic AI and a granted patent for automated auditing and recommendations• Why hard cost savings beat soft savings claims• GPO economics and why SMBs usually get left out• Integrations with QuickBooks, ERPs, and major vendor accounts for apples to apples comparisons• Self service onboarding, dashboards, and optional invoice uploads for analysis• Data privacy concerns, SOC 2 compliance, encryption, and API based access• Distribution through payment processors, banks, and associations• Embedded finance direction including lending, checking, and payroll• Employee member deals that bring corporate discounts to SMB teamsWe also dig into the practical model: connecting tools like QuickBooks and other ERP and accounting platforms, pulling invoices through APIs, and showing apples to apples comparisons that can unlock steep discounts through a tech enabled group purchasing organization. Since data access raises real concerns, we cover privacy and security head on, including SOC 2 compliance and encryption. Finally, we explore distribution through payment processors and other partners, plus the bigger ecosystem direction: embedded lending, checking, payroll, and employee member deals that bring corporate level discounts to smaller teams.Payments companies are hunting real value adds for merchants. This episode breaks down a $50/month savings platform, GPO pricing, and why “hard savings” beats “soft savings.”Subscribe for more conversations at the intersection of payments, fintech, and real world business operations, then share this episode and leave a review so more operators can find it. What’s the one recurring bill you’d love to cut down first?QuickBooks integration sounds great until you ask: where does my data go? Hear how SOC 2 compliance, encryption, and API based access shape trust in cost savings platforms.**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

June 3, 2026Episode 11026 min

Merchant of Record vs PayFac: MOR Explained: What Everyone Gets Wrong - Know The Difference | PEP110

“Merchant of record” gets thrown around nonstop, but it changes who owns the customer, the descriptor, and the liability. We break down what it really means and what it is not.“Merchant of record” sounds like a neat shortcut in payments until you realize it can change who owns the customer experience, who appears on the billing descriptor, and who gets stuck holding the bag when disputes, taxes, or regulators show up. We dig into what we’re seeing with Visa VAMP in the real world, including why the feared wave of mass shutdowns has not really materialized for legitimate merchants. Instead, many businesses are treating VAMP as an expensive new cost of doing business, especially when their ratios run hot.If you take the card, you might inherit the mess: chargebacks, refunds, sales tax, and even state platform fees. Merchant of record models can scale fast, but compliance gets weird fast.Christopher Dryden, Esq., and Jeremy Stock talk with Matthew Steinbrecher of Sound Commerce (https://sound-commerce.com/) break down what VAMP is actually doing in the market, why most merchants are paying the extra fees instead of getting shut down, and where subscription businesses get unfairly hit. Then we get precise about what “merchant of record” really means, how it differs from a true PayFac, and why tax and money movement rules can become the hidden risk.• VAMP impact showing up more in fees than shutdowns• Subscription disputes driven by TC40 and customer laziness• RDR and alert tooling dynamics with Verifi and Ethoca resellers• Downstream markups from sponsor banks, ISOs, and agents• Amex OptBlue threshold changes and basis point tradeoffs• MasterCard refund rate monitoring and why blanket rules misfire• Merchant of record explained as a large reseller with descriptor responsibility• PayFac defined role vs merchant of record as “just a merchant” in scheme rules• Money movement structures like FBO accounts vs direct redistribution risk• Indirect sales tax exposure and state platform fee surprisesWe also unpack why subscription businesses can look “high risk” on paper even when they are not. If customers can’t be bothered to cancel and just call their bank, those TC40 signals and chargebacks add up fast. That flows into the ecosystem around Rapid Dispute Resolution (RDR) and alert products like Verifi and Ethoca, where big merchants may get direct pricing while smaller merchants often pay through resellers with multiple layers of markup.VAMP panic vs VAMP reality: are merchants actually getting shut down, or just paying to play? Plus why subscription businesses get hammered by TC40 when customers call the bank instead of canceling.From there, we get specific about definitions. A real PayFac is a defined network role with underwriting and financial liability. A merchant of record, in plain terms, is often just a large reseller or distributor that takes the card, owns the descriptor, and handles customer service, which can create downstream exposure for indirect sales tax, money transmission, and even state specific platform fee laws. If you’re building a marketplace, platform, or merchant of record model, this is the compliance map you want before you scale.Subscribe, share this with someone building in payments, and leave a review if it helped. What part of the merchant of record vs PayFac debate do you want us to go deeper on?**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

May 13, 2026Episode 10926 min

Why Merchants Get MATCH’d After Fraud They Didn’t Cause: Inside the BRAM Fine System | PEP109

Negotiation changes when you have leverage. Our playbook: lock out debits, demand the underlying basis, and force real answers, sometimes by filing a complaint.A six figure “brand fine” lands out of nowhere, nobody will show you the underlying letter, and the funds can get pulled before you even have a chance to respond. That is the reality we see for merchants caught in the gap between card network rules, sponsor bank obligations, and the merchant processing agreement that quietly shifts liability downstream. We sit down with Global Legal Law Firm attorneys Christopher Dryden and Bryce Van De Moere to talk through why these penalties feel so arbitrary, why the numbers can swing from $50,000 to $200,000, and why the system often seems designed to keep merchants in the dark.We break down how brand reputation fines get assessed upstream and shoved downhill until the merchant is left holding the bill with little to no explanation. We also share the tactics we use to force transparency, protect cash flow, and negotiate when a processor or bank refuses to engage.• how brand fines work between card brands, sponsor banks, processors, ISOs, and merchants• why merchants often cannot see the brand letter or the alleged offending behavior• how “taking first” undermines notice and an opportunity to be heard• why brand fines can be negotiable despite being presented as non-negotiable• when it makes sense to lock out debits to create leverage• why we sometimes skip demand letters and go straight to a filed complaint• how consolidation in payments limits merchant choice and increases riskWe walk through the full chain of responsibility from the card brand to the sponsor bank to the processor to the ISO, and finally to the business owner trying to make payroll. Along the way, we dig into the most frustrating part: the lack of transparency and the lack of a fair process. If you have ever asked, “How can I defend myself if no one will tell me what I did,” we tackle that head on, including what we have seen actually move the needle when compliance teams refuse to engage.Then we get practical about leverage and outcomes. We talk about why locking out debits can change the negotiation, how and why brand fines can sometimes be negotiated down, and when escalation to a filed complaint is the only way to trigger real deadlines and real accountability. If you care about merchant rights, payment processing compliance, and protecting small business cash flow, this conversation is for you. Subscribe, share this with a business owner who takes cards, and leave a review with the question you want us to answer next.Processors can pull funds before you even get notice. We break down the chain from card network to sponsor bank to processor to ISO to merchant, and why “due process” disappears in payments. **Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

May 6, 2026Episode 10825 min

The Secret to Merchant Stickiness? Rewards Instead of Rate Cuts with Guest Tuzo Rewards | PEP108

Payment processing often feels like a tax and when every ISO sells the same terminals, the same funding speed, and the same basic promises, the only lever left is price. That is how the industry ends up in a race to the bottom, with merchants switching for a few basis points because they have no real reason to stay. Christopher Dryden, Esq., talks with Tuzo Rewards, Global Legal friends Jeff & Hersh Moskowitz, about a different approach: merchant rewards that are earned on gross processing volume, built to improve merchant retention, boost engagement, and create value the merchant can actually feel.We break down how merchant rewards can change payment processing from a pure commodity into a relationship that creates real loyalty. We share stories and data on how points drive faster go-live, better retention, higher margin deals, and more referrals. • framing payment processing as a tax and why merchants do not feel the hidden work behind it • how a merchant rewards program ties points to gross processing volume • the Rolex deal story that sparks the original rewards concept • why price competition creates a race to zero and how rewards reduce price sensitivity • creating positive touch points through redemption support and human service • turning redemptions into ISO follow-ups and referral campaigns • how integrations work behind ISVs and processor back ends • merchants using points for employee incentives and customer giveaways We tell the origin story that made the concept click, including a hard lesson about losing a deal on a commodity offer and realizing incentives can outperform rate cuts. From there, we dig into what changed over the past year: real-world examples of “positive touch points” created through redemptions, how support calls can become relationship builders, and why that human layer matters when most merchant interactions only happen when something breaks. We also connect the dots between consumer rewards, interchange economics, dual pricing, and surcharging pressure, then explain why giving merchants points can feel like long overdue payback.Payment processing is a commodity until you add a reason to stay. A merchant rewards program can turn price shoppers into loyal partners and even drive referrals. We close with the growth mechanics: referral campaigns powered by bonus points, how some agents use rewards to win switches and protect margin, and how merchants get creative by turning points into employee incentives and customer giveaways. If you work in merchant services, ISO sales, or payments strategy, this is a practical blueprint for differentiating without racing to zero. Subscribe, share this with a payments friend, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway.Visit Tuzo Rewards today! https://www.tuzorewards.com/ **Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.** PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/https://www.buzzsprout.com/2176695A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

April 22, 2026Episode 10722 min

Why Processors Freeze Accounts (And How to Avoid It) | How Merchants Survive & Even Thrive | PEP107

Stripe approved the merchant… then froze funds and refunded customers anyway. How do you protect your business when the processor owns the relationship?One day your payments are flowing. The next day a platform decides it “doesn’t support your product,” freezes your balance, and refunds your customers while you’re left holding the shipping bill. That risk is closer than most merchants think, especially if you rely on a single merchant-of-record provider for credit card processing, recurring billing, and customer data.James Huber, Jeremy Stock, and special guest, Allen Kopelman, of Nationwide Payment Systems (https://nationwidepaymentsystems.com/) unpack the real-world tension between card brand rules and the free market: credit card surcharging, dual pricing, disclosure requirements, and why extreme fees push customers to competitors. From Visa and MasterCard enforcement to the practical “show me the receipt and the signage” proof points, we talk about what compliant fee programs look like and why clarity matters more than cleverness.Then we zoom out to the bigger payments trend: software beats rate quotes. We discuss why merchants want an “easy button” experience with payment links, invoicing, ACH payments, gateway tools, and a single dashboard that ties everything together across locations and merchant accounts. On the risk side, we cover chargebacks, friendly fraud, and how monitoring programs like VAMP can ripple from banks to merchants, even when you think you’re doing everything right.We dig into why payment rules keep shifting and why “just pass the fee along” can backfire when customers have choices. We also break down how software, data control, and smart risk management keep merchants from getting trapped by chargebacks, VAMP pressure, or a sudden processor shutdown.•Free market reality of surcharges and customer behavior•Why clear rules beat surprise enforcement•Software-first selling versus rate-first selling•The NPS1 approach to bundling cards, ACH, gateway, invoicing, and payment links•One dashboard visibility for multi-location merchants•What dual pricing letters and compliance checks look like•Why Ticketmaster-style fee stacks feel unavoidable•How VAMP changes portfolio risk and merchant exposure•Chargeback volume, friendly fraud, and faster dispute responses•Aggregator risk: restricted products, MATCH list, held funds, and voided batches•Merchant of record problems and why data ownership matters•Using CRMs and subscription tools to avoid platform lock-inThe takeaway is simple and urgent: build for control. Own your data, protect your customer relationship with a CRM or subscription layer, and avoid putting 100% of your revenue through one processor. If this helped you rethink your payment processing strategy, subscribe, share the episode with a merchant friend, and leave a quick review telling us what topic you want next.**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/https://www.buzzsprout.com/2176695A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

April 14, 2026Episode 10620 min

Dual Pricing Done Right: 2026 Practical Guide To Cash Discount And Surcharging Compliance | PEP106

Surcharging caps. Debit card limits. Fines that flow through banks. If you’ve ever wondered who really profits from card payments, this conversation will change how you see Checkout is turning into a trust test. Customers hate surprise fees, merchants hate absorbing card costs, and the rules around surcharging, cash discount, and dual pricing keep getting more confusing. We sit down with Clark Krimer from National ePayment (https://nationalepayment.com/) to get practical about what actually works at the point of sale and why so many business owners only change pricing once the shop next door does it.We break down why merchants hesitate to adopt dual pricing and what actually happens when customers see a cash price next to a card price. Clark Krimer explains how payments sales works in the real world and why better pricing disclosure is the missing piece in credit card processing.• merchants waiting for nearby businesses to adopt dual pricing first• why customers assume surcharges are merchant profit• how dual pricing differs from surcharging and cash discounting• Visa-style disclosure expectations and the operational challenge of changing prices• Do Price Digital Labeler printing cash and card prices• California restaurant fee disclosures and why menus create risk• how fines and enforcement pressure flow through banks and processors• why payments education stays low and transparency stays hardWe talk through the real economics of credit card processing fees: why a simple surcharge cap often fails to cover the full spread, why debit card restrictions complicate “pass-through” pricing, and why customers often assume the merchant is pocketing the difference. From there, we dig into the compliance problem that trips up otherwise honest businesses. If a fee is disclosed poorly, especially in restaurants and other high-traffic environments, it can trigger complaints, fines, or even litigation. The conversation also touches California’s junk fee environment and why menu disclosure is becoming a legal flashpoint.Then we get hands-on with a surprisingly effective fix: Do Price Digital Labeler, a tool designed to make dual pricing easy in retail by printing a single label with both the cash price and the card price. It’s a small operational detail with a big impact on price transparency, customer clarity, and brand rules alignment.If you care about payments compliance, merchant services strategy, or the future of surcharging and dual pricing, this one is for you. Subscribe, share this with a merchant who is struggling with fees, and leave a review with your take: should the customer see two prices everywhere?**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/https://www.buzzsprout.com/2176695A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

April 6, 2026Episode 10516 min

AI Hallucinates a Refund Policy (It Didn't Exist) & The Business Paid: Rogue AI in Payments | PEP105

Software that negotiates prices and completes payments for you sounds convenient until it hallucinates a refund policy.Software that can shop, negotiate, and pay for you is no longer science fiction, and it is already colliding with the realities of payments risk. We sit down with Dale Laszig from the Green Sheet (https://www.greensheet.com/) to break down agentic commerce in plain English and explain what changes when “the customer” is a digital agent acting autonomously at real-time speed.We unpack agentic commerce, where software acts on a buyer’s behalf and can search, negotiate, and complete payments without a human in the loop. We connect the promise of automation to real risks like hallucinated refund policies, AI-driven fraud, and the need for tighter contracts plus continuous monitoring.• Defining agentic commerce in plain English for payments teams• Why rules-based AI can be safer than LLMs• The airline refund story and what it teaches about liability• How AI changes chargebacks and dispute response workflows• Deepfakes and synthetic merchants targeting onboarding gaps• The shift from one-time KYC to continuous behavioral monitoring• AI versus AI dynamics in fraud and risk decisioningWe dig into a memorable cautionary tale where an AI system hallucinated a refund policy and the business had to honor it, then connect that lesson to chargebacks, dispute management, and the legal pressure points that show up when machines make commitments. From our perspective as payments-focused counsel, the practical starting point is updating contracts, policies, and training so liability is clear and teams know how to respond when automation goes sideways.From there, we get concrete about the fraud landscape: deepfakes, synthetic merchants, fake documents, and the growing gap between merchant onboarding and ongoing behavior monitoring. The big takeaway is that “set it and forget it” KYC does not hold up in an always-on world. We talk about building a multi-layered trust infrastructure with strong identity signals, behavioral monitoring, governance frameworks, and AI-powered fraud detection tools, because it often takes AI to spot AI.AI fighting chargebacks meets AI pushing fraud. Who wins when machines argue at scale? We talk contracts, liability shifts, and why you should partner with security experts instead of building tools yourself.If you work in payments, underwriting, risk, or compliance, this conversation will help you think clearly about agentic commerce, AI fraud, and what readiness should look like right now. Subscribe, share this with a colleague in the industry, and leave a review with your biggest question about AI in payments.**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/https://www.buzzsprout.com/2176695A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

April 1, 2026Episode 10414 min

PayFac vs Merchant of Record: The Risk No One Explains | Guest Deana Rich of Infinicept | PEP104

“Merchant of record” sounds easy, until you realize it isn’t a defined term. We break down PayFac vs MOR, why rules exist, and how people accidentally step into money transmitter risk.PayFac is one of those payments terms people toss around until they’re the one holding the liability. We sit down with Deana Rich of Infinicept (https://www.infinicept.com/) to map the real payment facilitator story, from the scrappy early days of online “aggregators” to the moment Visa and Mastercard finally wrapped rules around what the market was already doing. Along the way, we revisit the rise of PayPal in the late 90s and how Square’s tiny dongle changed face-to-face acceptance for millions of small merchants.We trace how the payment facilitator model went from “against the rules” behavior to a core part of embedded payments for SaaS platforms. We also dig into why “merchant of record” shortcuts can create serious compliance and even criminal risk if money flow and onboarding are handled the wrong way.• Deana Rich’s path into payments through bank merchant operations and early electronic processing• A clear definition of a payment facilitator and submerchant liability• How PayPal and early online aggregators pressured the ecosystem to evolve• Visa’s IPSP framework and the role of high-risk categories in shaping rules• Square’s in-person breakout and why Visa and Mastercard formalized PayFac rules• Why embedded payments fits vertical SaaS and ISVs, plus add-ons like lending and insurance• Why “merchant of record” is not a defined standard and what that means in practice• KYC basics including owners, OFAC screening, and MATCH list checks• How poor structuring can trigger money transmitter issues and bank fraud exposureVisit us online today at Global Legal Law Firm dot com.We also get practical about what a payment facilitator actually does: bringing submerchants under a master program, taking on risk, handling settlement flows, and operating the underwriting and monitoring that keeps the whole thing stable. If you’re building embedded payments for a SaaS platform or ISV, this is the part that matters most because the upside is real: tighter product control, better vertical fit, and the ability to add services like reporting, insurance, or even merchant lending based on payment performance.Then we hit the uncomfortable topic: “merchant of record.” It sounds like an easier path, but it isn’t a consistently defined standard, and the wrong structure can pull you into KYC gaps, OFAC and MATCH list blind spots, money transmitter exposure, and even bank fraud allegations if you’re processing for businesses you didn’t disclose. If you’re building, buying, or advising a payments program, this conversation is your reminder that shortcuts in payments can get very expensive.If you’re “processing for other businesses” under your own merchant account, you may be creating bank fraud exposure. This conversation is a wake-up call on KYC, OFAC, MATCH, and liability. **Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm

March 23, 2026Episode 10315 min

How Dual Pricing and Surcharging Changed ISOs Forever: Payments Now Residuals Risk & Growth | PEP103

A single receipt can change how you see the payments industry. When Naveed from KV Payments notices a 4% card charge at a mechanic shop, it triggers the question every small business owner eventually asks: where is all that processing margin going, and how do you price merchant services fairly without stepping into a compliance mess?We walk through Naveed’s unconventional path into payment processing, from relationship banking at Chase to the hard reality of building an ISO portfolio the slow way: door to door, account by account, learning interchange plus economics, and chasing the long game of residual income. Along the way, we talk candidly about what early-stage merchant services sales really feels like, why “easy money” narratives fall apart, and how persistence and clear communication win more than slick pitches.Then we dig into surcharging and dual pricing, including the practical questions Naveed asked at the start: is it legal, what’s actually compliant, and why did Visa’s rule changes force the industry to tighten its approach? From there, the conversation opens up into how KV Payments scales by staying flexible across verticals, building referral engines, deploying POS for hospitality, exploring utilities brokerage in deregulated states, and leaning into cannabis payments where cashless ATM has played a major role.If you care about payment processing strategy, merchant services pricing, ISO growth, and staying on the right side of card brand rules, this one is packed with hard-earned lessons. Subscribe for more conversations like this, share the episode with a payments friend, and leave a review with the biggest pricing question you want answered next.In this episode, we sit down with Naveed Khan, founder of KV Payments, to trace a journey that mirrors the payments industry itself: accidental entry, relentless hustle, and hard-earned lessons in margins, compliance, and merchant relationships.Hosted by Leo Arzumanyan and Jeremy Stock, this conversation goes beyond the highlight reel. Naveed walks through his early days in banking, the discovery of residual income, and the realities of building a book of business door-to-door in one of the toughest sales environments imaginable. From Chicago winters to inner-city merchant acquisition, this is the unfiltered version of how ISOs are actually built.The episode also dives into the evolution of merchant pricing—particularly the rise of surcharging and dual pricing—and the confusion that followed. What started as a “simple” idea of passing fees to customers quickly became a compliance minefield shaped by Visa and Mastercard rules, shifting enforcement, and operational gray areas.From there, the conversation expands into modern ISO strategy:Building a diversified portfolio across verticals like cannabis, utilities, and hospitalityStructuring ISO relationships and brokerage-style models to capture more deal flowLeveraging residuals, referrals, and partnerships to create long-term revenue streamsNavigating compliance shifts that can instantly impact pricing models and merchant expectationsYou’ll also hear how today’s most successful operators think differently—focusing less on single deals and more on ecosystems, partnerships, and lifetime merchant value.**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**PEP Links:https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/podcasts/https://www.buzzsprout.com/2176695A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm