The Kitchen Table

Hosted by Ken Baden

Business Entrepreneurship Education

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154

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Aug 2026

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About the show

A show about business, sales, goals, and the pursuit of personal greatness, all where business gets done. The Kitchen Table.

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September 5, 202647 min

The Truth About Call Centers & Cold Calling for Roofers with Peter Roth

🗒️ EPISODE NOTES Peter Roth returns for his second appearance on The Kitchen Table Podcast, this time bringing detailed numbers and frameworks. Scalify specializes exclusively in human-driven outbound cold calling (AI cold calling is illegal) for booking home service estimates — no inbound, no lead reselling as a primary offering. Scalify builds fully-managed, client-owned call centers: the client owns everything, pays agents directly, and can cancel the management contract month-to-month. The "funnel" framework: bottom-of-funnel leads (people actively shopping) are few and expensive to fight over; top-of-funnel prospects (not yet problem-aware) are a much larger, less-contested pool — which is where cold calling and canvassing ("digital door knocking") come in. About two-thirds of Scalify's clients are insurance restoration roofers, one-third retail. Private equity buyers favor companies with proprietary lead generation because it reduces "de-risking" concerns tied to weather-dependent insurance work. Standard agent ratios: roughly 3 call center agents per 1 closer (assuming an empty calendar); similar to the 2-3:1 canvasser-to-closer ratio in door knocking. Cold callers speak to ~250 people/day with a sub-1% booking rate (1-2 appointments/day); door knockers speak to ~8-10 homeowners/day with higher lead quality but far lower volume. Average show rate on cold-call-booked appointments is around 40%. Typical roofing cost-per-acquisition via traditional marketing is ~$25 (on a great day); Scalify's clients typically see cost-per-acquisition around $900-1,000 — but with a call center, one deal's profit usually pays for the entire build-out (~$8-10K to build, ~$8-9K/month to run). Real client case study: a door-knocking-only operator spending $25K/month saw 1.5x ROI; switching to a call center model produced 6x ROI. The "secret sauce" of a call center isn't the agents, script, or dialer — it's the management team (a 4-person management team is often needed to run just 3 agents). Hiring "green" (untrained) reps and training them from scratch tends to outperform hiring "seasoned" reps with bad inbound-lead habits, because outbound sales requires creating urgency the prospect didn't have before the call. Case study: Victor Rencore, a well-known HVAC operator with 17 companies, deliberately avoids "replacement call" leads (price-shopping, bottom-of-funnel) in favor of top-of-funnel outbound leads. Power Home Remodeling's business model is built almost entirely on canvassing, allowing them to charge premium prices because their leads aren't price-shopping. Live transfers explained: the cold-calling agent does all the qualifying and rapport-building, then transfers the live call to a rotating pool of sales reps' cell phones (random or ring-all), rewarding "speed to lead." Live transfers can increase appointment volume by 25-60% because agents get back on the phone faster, and pre-built rapport improves show rates and close rates. Scalify stays a specialist in outbound cold calling only — Peter refers clients elsewhere for inbound, live transfer add-ons from other sources, canvassing, and SEO rather than trying to do it all.

August 29, 202624 min

I Learned This the Hard Way: Scaling Past $10M in Insurance Restoration | Ken Baden

Episode Notes Why Ken loves doing solo episodes — using the platform for pure value, no guest filter The "lean and mean" strategy that worked great... until it didn't The complacency factor: why sales reps unconsciously coast once they hit a comfortable income The fix: going all-in on recruiting, scaling from 5-7 reps to 15-20 across two offices Why team leads need to be physically in the field with new reps, not managing from afar Ken's decision to personally handle Day 1 onboarding and training for every new hire The "zone of genius" concept (credit to his coach Brandon) and why some things can't be delegated The math behind the growth goal: 15 reps per office, 4 contracts/week at $20K = $1.2M/week Two biggest lessons of the year: never forget the complacency factor, and live in your zone of genius Insurance restoration sales: why too many reps avoid confrontation and big-ticket conversations Setting proper expectations with homeowners at every step (ACV checks, timelines, next steps) Who's actually responsible for what: the insurance carrier's job vs. the contractor's job Why avoiding potential problems creates bigger problems down the line Office revamp, personal branding, and the morning mantra that's shifted team energy What's coming up next: guests including a musician/entrepreneur and Ken's recruiting team

August 22, 202634 min

Taming Your Money Monster: The Real Cost of Entrepreneurship with Nancy Benet

Episode Notes Nancy's background: raised by parents with limited means, inspired by a family friend who was a CPA Left a traditional accounting career path after realizing she disliked tax, audit, and corporate work Became a stay-at-home mom while helping her husband start businesses — five failed along the way Hit rock bottom at 45: divorced, four kids, $100/week child support, $650,000 in debt Bought a tax prep firm that fell through the day after signing a 3-year office lease Built her firm by marketing to people with public federal tax liens during the recession Learned those clients weren't ideal long-term and repositioned toward recurring revenue (monthly tax/CFO services) Founded Success Your Way to teach entrepreneurial mindset and business basics to newer founders Discusses LLC vs. S-corp election and why a sole-member LLC is often the right starting entity The "set your new zero" lesson from a friend that reshaped her relationship with cash reserves Wrote Tame Your Money Monster (releasing January 20th) as a result of her own financial mismanagement Candid discussion on lifestyle inflation, especially in insurance restoration roofing/solar businesses Tax strategy talk: why spending to "save on taxes" often costs more than it saves Real estate as a legitimate long-term tax strategy — but only after building a real income base Closing advice: "Manage your money well — that is what leads to peace in your life" Ken plugs Baden Consulting's retail roofing consultation for storm/insurance restoration roofers

August 15, 202627 min

From Cleaning Gutters to Running a Roofing Empire: Shane Michael's Story

Episode Notes Shane got his start in construction in 2013 doing gutter cleaning and repairs before moving into general contracting, flooring, and eventually car sales. He launched his own business about 8-9 years ago and later transitioned fully into roofing roughly five years ago. A standout early sale: a homeowner with 50-60 solar panels closed in under three minutes for a $12K job. Shane and Ken discuss learning from sales trainers (referencing Adam and the "SLAP" sales framework vs. Ken's "3 W's"). Recruiting struggles this summer left both companies short-staffed heading into peak storm season. Storm activity has been unusually high this year in the DMV compared to the last several years. Two unusual insurance claim situations: carriers asking for pre-purchase home inspections before releasing funds, and a homeowner discovering a $23,000 deductible that left him covering 52% of an ~$80K roof. Discussion on where premiums, deductibles, and claim requirements might be heading next year. Why aggressive, professional closers consistently outperform sloppy canvassing teams — and why sending canvassers into a competitive area can backfire. Zeus Contracting is expanding into Delaware, Pennsylvania, and Virginia, with plans to grow paid advertising (Google/Facebook) heading into winter. Zeus Contracting posted a record month: 55 signed deals worth over $900,000. ⏱️ Timestamps 00:00 – Intro & catching up with Shane Michael 01:09 – Shane's start in construction (2013): gutters, repairs & general contracting 02:30 – Transitioning into sales, including a stint in car sales 04:45 – Starting his own business ~8-9 years ago 05:25 – Going full-time into roofing & the fast solar panel sale 06:33 – Sales training, mentors, and the "SLAP" vs. "3 W's" methods 08:04 – Recruiting struggles and rebuilding the sales team 10:39 – This year's storm activity and market response 12:15 – Odd insurance claim: pre-purchase inspection required for payout 13:37 – Digging into how that requirement can even be legal 14:35 – Deductible shock: 48% out-of-pocket on an $80K+ roof 15:31 – Where deductibles and policies are headed next year 20:15 – Finding opportunity in a "down" market 22:08 – Why the industry is thinning out — and why that's a good thing 22:27 – Canvassers vs. closers: professionalism and close rates 25:39 – Company culture, integrity, and core values 25:53 – What's next for Zeus Contracting 26:26 – Expansion plans into Delaware, PA & Virginia 26:46 – Record month: 55 deals, $900K+ in signed work 27:32 – Where to find Shane Michael & Zeus Contracting online

August 8, 202632 min

Solo Episode: Mindset, Hiring, and the Stronghouse Rumors | The Kitchen Table Podcast w/ Ken Baden

Episode Notes Ken explains why this is a solo episode and gives a quick update on upcoming guest scheduling The story behind his Audi R8's third blown motor and the lesson learned about modifying performance cars How a Warren Buffett-inspired gratitude mindset helped him reframe a costly setback Setting the record straight on rumors that Stronghouse Roofing was insolvent Why Ken sees "blood in the water" opportunity as competitors cut staff and salaries Behind the scenes of his company's mass hiring and training push, including working with an outside recruiting firm Why Ken and his business partner Justin are personally training every recruit Advice for contractors considering adding a retail division to their insurance restoration business Why fall and spring are the money-making seasons for retail roofing What Ken looks for before taking on a new consulting client The daily 8:30 AM morning mantra his team recites, and the psychology behind it (including the "red car theory") Why belief and mindset matter as much as strategy when market conditions shift Personal update: family, an upcoming trip, and staying grounded amid rapid company growth Timestamps 00:00 – Solo episode intro and guest scheduling update 01:11 – Ken's Audi R8 blows its third motor 04:26 – Reframing setbacks with gratitude (the Warren Buffett flat tire story) 06:14 – Why Ken's been posting more about his wife lately 07:38 – Setting the record straight: Stronghouse insolvency rumors debunked 09:53 – "Blood in the water": why Ken is going all-in on growth this year 12:49 – Inside the company's mass hiring and training push 14:39 – Why Ken and Justin are personally training every recruit 15:33 – Advice for contractors considering a retail roofing division 19:00 – What to look for (and avoid) when vetting a coach or consultant 20:59 – Team hits goal — pizza party moment 23:00 – The origin of the daily morning mantra 26:39 – Breaking down the mantra: the "red car theory" and unconscious opportunity 28:19 – The full morning mantra, word for word 30:59 – Personal update, family plans, and closing thoughts

July 24, 202636 min

From Chick-fil-A to $10M: Zach Sasser's Roofing Empire

Episode Notes Zach grew up in a roofing family in DFW; his dad transitioned from mortgages into roofing after the 2008 crash. Zach sold his first roofs at 17 after a hometown storm, earning around $10K in one summer — more than a full summer at Chick-fil-A. He studied marketing in college, believing that knowing how to get customers translates across any industry. Interned with the APEX mastermind under Stuman, surrounded by established roofing/home-service leaders; became top sales producer within 18 months and stayed about 5 years. About 4 years ago, Zach began helping his brother Brett grow Lone Star Exteriors — from roughly $1.2M to $9.5M last year, on pace for just over $10M this year. Discussion of regional insurance differences: DFW average deductible ~$7,000 vs. as low as $500 in parts of Oklahoma; ACV-only policies and roof payment schedules are increasingly common in Texas. State-level insurance regulation varies significantly (e.g., Delaware vs. Maryland) and impacts deductible/depreciation rules. The "Keep the Check" program: financing full job costs when insurance underpays (e.g., 40–50% coverage), helping homeowners avoid dipping into savings or high-interest credit card debt. Zach's company is roughly 95%+ insurance restoration and a small retail percentage, but expects retail/financing hybrid models to grow as ACV-only policies increase. Mindset segment: the impact of NLP techniques, daily positive affirmations with his team, and the "red car theory" (you see what you look for). Zach invested $50K in recruiting this year and brought on a team of commercial roofing reps from a company that did $140M the prior year. Long-term goals: hit 8 figures this year, with sights on $25–30M as the company scales systems and processes. Discussion on goal-setting flexibility — learning when to adjust targets rather than rigidly chasing a number, informed by a past overexpansion lesson. Where to find Zach: primarily active on Facebook and Instagram; company is Lone Star Exteriors, founded by his brother in 2018.

July 17, 20261 hr 0 min

From the Roof to Federal Contracts: David Michaelson's Playbook for Retail Roofing Success

EPISODE NOTES David Michaelson is President of Michaelson Roofing Improvements (MRI), based in Reston, VA MRI does roofing plus is pursuing HIC (Home Improvement Contractor) licensing for full exterior work Reston, VA has a unique planned-community history (founded by Robert E. Simon, former owner of Carnegie Hall) The DMV roofing market was down significantly last year; heavy reliance on government/military employment makes the region sensitive to federal workforce changes Insurance industry shifts: ACV policies, RPS schedules, and carriers pushing back on claims are changing how contractors approach insurance work MRI now does approximately 80% retail / 20% insurance work Discussion on UPPA (public adjusting law) violations and staying compliant "Trust" is framed as the new competitive currency — both with customers and with Google's search algorithms/trust signals Personal branding segment: "dressing with intention," and the idea that "the inside of your house is the inside of your head" David is a veteran and recently became a Service-Disabled Veteran-Owned Small Business (SDVOSB) Explanation of the PACT Act and presumptive service-related conditions for Gulf War-era veterans 78% of the $34 billion in federal SDVOSB set-aside contracting funds are concentrated in Northern Virginia Fiscal Year 2027 SBA budget cuts many set-aside designations but leaves SDVOSB funding untouched — creating a growing opportunity for veteran contractors Ken shares a real-time decision to quintuple his recruiting budget and take a short-term cash infusion to hire aggressively during a slower market Discussion of EOS (Entrepreneur Operating System) / "Traction" by Gino Wickman, and how breaking big goals into daily measurables makes them achievable Closing segment: David's son "Gogo" runs a charity lemonade stand (Gogo's Lemonade Stand) benefiting "Readers Are Leaders," with MRI matching sales ⏱️ TIMESTAMPS 00:00 – Intro & DC/Maryland traffic banter 01:34 – "Northern Virginia is an awesome market" — licensing (HIC vs. ROC) discussion 03:31 – Reston's history and unique market makeup 06:02 – Maryland's proximity-to-DC dynamics & government layoffs impact 06:49 – State of the roofing market (down 19-20% last year) 08:17 – Insurance industry shifts: ACV policies, RPS schedules 08:50 – UPPA violation story (contractor advertising as a public adjuster) 09:44 – "Hand storm" / insurance-chasing culture, old-school tactics 11:31 – Trust as the new competitive currency (with customers and Google) 12:14 – Shifting to 80/20 retail-focused business 12:25 – How MRI handles "naturally occurring" roof damage vs. storm claims 15:47 – Dressing with intention & personal branding 16:56 – Skill vs. communication — the "9 skill, 4 communication = 4" lesson 21:58 – "The inside of your house is the inside of your head" 23:04 – Starting each day with a small win 24:02 – Why David started his own company 24:26 – Build to sell vs. build to stay 25:05 – Grandfather's story & thinking about legacy for his son 28:36 – Getting older in the roofing business — staying off the roof 29:03 – Working ON the business, not IN it 29:32 – Becoming a Service-Disabled Veteran-Owned Small Business 30:47 – Explaining the PACT Act 32:25 – Federal contracting summit takeaways 34:31 – $34 billion in federal set-asides, 78% concentrated in Northern Virginia 35:24 – Where to find MRI (MRIProHelp.com) 35:57 – "There's enough for everybody" — David's business philosophy 37:39 – FY2027 SBA budget cuts announced 38:18 – SDVOSB funding left untouched by the cuts 39:08 – Why diversifying revenue streams matters (avoiding being "the dinosaur") 40:55 – Cautionary tale: a $75M+ company's CFO scrambling for cash 43:20 – A 24-year Northern Virginia roofer on the toughest market he's seen 46:04 – Ken's decision to quintuple the recruiting budget 47:37 – Taking a cash infusion loan to fund aggressive hiring 49:45 – "Every crisis creates opportunity" 53:13 – EOS / Traction and the L10 quarterly meeting 53:54 – Personal story: helping his son push through a bike injury toward his black belt 55:34 – "What you feed grows" — the power of measurables 56:29 – Wrapping up the main conversation 57:01 – Gogo's Lemonade Stand charity plug 57:50 – MRI services recap (Brava, Hardy certifications, etc.) 59:18 – Closing thanks & sign-off

July 10, 202628 min

Roofing State of the Union: Why We're Betting Big on Recruiting

EPISODE NOTES Ken explains why he's committing to more solo episodes to focus on the "state of the union" of the roofing/home services industry How EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System) helps break yearly goals down to weekly, department-level numbers The difference between a mentor (free) and a coach (paid) — and why Ken still values both Recruiting was identified as the company's #1 issue, not marketing Canvassing still drives 70–80% of leads; a 3:1 canvasser-to-closer ratio is the industry benchmark Why an internal recruiter alone can't scale fast enough for rapid multi-market growth Ken's belief that Potomac Custom Remodeling can become the premier roofing company in the DMV within 1–2 years The decision to hire an outside recruiting company — and the "spend the money to force commitment" mindset (the gym/soccer analogy) Balancing entrepreneurial risk-taking against CFO/accountant advice Lessons from time spent with his friend Brandon, who scaled a business from $5M to $80M+ Why Ken got jaded with coaches/gurus early on, but still believes the core concepts (affirmations, manifestation, NLP) work The importance of rebuilding company culture and reinvesting in people A new couple's practice: daily affirmations inspired by friends Brandon and Kelly, and getting his wife Becca more involved in the business and finances Reflections on taking a real vacation for the first time and recharging Closing thoughts on gratitude, opportunity, and America around the 4th of July

June 19, 202637 min

The Canvassing Blueprint: How to Build a Door-to-Door Team That Actually Works

Justin Donawa has been in the canvassing industry for 8.5 years, starting at age 19 while in college and rising to VP of Field Marketing at Potomac Custom Remodeling. The episode digs into why leads are the #1 challenge for any retail home improvement company — and why canvassing remains the most immediate and cost-effective solution. Insurance restoration vs. retail canvassing: the key structural differences and why retail requires a setter/closer model. Hiring advice: why you should try to talk candidates OUT of the job during the interview to filter for genuine grit and commitment. Great canvassers succeed because people buy from people they like — not from the one who knows the most. Training fundamentals: daily out-loud pitch repetitions, recording yourself, and getting third-party feedback are non-negotiable. Gamification tactics: objection-handling competitions, pair pitching in front of the team, and rotating partners and neighborhoods keep teams sharp and engaged. Strong leadership is a retention tool — canvassers stay when they respect and learn from their manager. Why canvassing still outperforms digital leads: human trust and authentic interaction beat search results, especially as AI-driven content erodes homeowner trust online. Recruiting is the most underrated part of building a retail department — companies likely already have strong candidates sitting in their past applicant files. Viewers are invited to drop questions in the comments for potential future episodes with Justin.

June 5, 202627 min

From Homeless to $3–5 Million: Cory Smeallie's Roofing Redemption Story

Guest: Cory Smeallie, Owner & CEO of TrueShield Exteriors LLC (Northeast Ohio) Host: Ken Baden, CEO/Owner of Baden Consulting & Potomac Custom Remodeling Cory shares his personal story of addiction and recovery — last use date: April 10, 2014 His entry into sales came through a Facebook video from Josh Diamond Burger of Next Gen TrueShield Exteriors launched just over a year ago; did $300K in year one, pacing $3–5M currently Cory brought his father on as production manager when starting the company Discussion of the major Northeast Ohio hailstorm and what it means for the market Cory's philosophy: fix small things for free to build trust and earn long-term customers Book recommendation: Beyond the Hammer — highly recommended for contractors and business owners The insurance restoration game has changed: documentation and professionalism matter more than ever Cory's hiring philosophy: value people's goals and full lives, not just their output He's currently recruiting sales reps in Ohio — reach out via his socials or website 🌐 TrueShield Exteriors: https://www.trueshieldexteriors.net/ 📸 @neighborhoodroofer: https://www.instagram.com/neighborhoodroofer/ 🌐 Baden Consulting: https://www.badenconsulting.net/ 🌐 The Kitchen Table Podcast: https://www.thekitchentablepodcast.net/ TIMESTAMPS 0:00 — Introduction & Welcome 0:18 — Ken introduces Cory Smeallie from Northeast Ohio 1:13 — The record-breaking Ohio hailstorm & what it means for roofers 3:21 — How Cory got into the industry — 10 years in roofing 4:26 — Finding roofing sales through a Facebook video from Josh Diamond Burger 6:00 — Cory's rocky past: the factory accident, opioid addiction & homelessness 7:11 — Getting clean April 10, 2014 — how recovery led to opportunity 9:00 — What roofing attracts people in recovery & the instant gratification culture 10:38 — The "chuck in a truck" era vs. being a true professional in the space 12:01 — Stop looking for magic scripts — documentation and consistency win 13:17 — TrueShield Exteriors: just over a year old, $300K year one, pacing $3–5M 14:07 — Bringing his dad up from South Carolina as production manager 15:15 — Doing small jobs for free to build trust and earn word-of-mouth referrals 16:19 — Book recommendation: Beyond the Hammer 17:03 — Growth plans, longevity, and building something his son can inherit 18:00 — Why he started his own company: controlling the customer experience 20:02 — Baden Consulting's vision and what the right investing partner could unlock 21:06 — Running the business daily: playing sales manager while building the team 21:33 — His top retail rep: a former X Games racer turned roofer 23:12 — Finding talent in unexpected places (the gym, a gas station) 23:50 — Hiring a current EMT/firefighter and paying for half his schooling 25:00 — Building a culture where people want to show up 26:07 — How to find Cory and TrueShield Exteriors online 27:27 — Wrap-up & closing