Numbers and Narratives

Hosted by Sean Collins and Ibby Syed

Business Marketing Entrepreneurship

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Latest episode

Feb 2026

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EN-US

About the show

Numbers and Narratives bridges the gap between the marketing/customer experience and data - come listen to marketing and CX experts talk about how to use data to better engage with your customers and provide a great experience.

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60 recent

February 16, 202629 min

Grant Durando on Modern Offline Growth

If you’ve ever wondered why “offline” marketing is suddenly one of the most trackable parts of the modern growth stack, this episode is for you. I’m joined by Grant Durando (Right Side Up), the agency partner who first got me into podcast marketing and taught me how the audio ecosystem actually works, from attribution to execution to scaling beyond Meta.In this conversation, we get practical about what’s changing in 2026 growth marketing: how podcast, radio, and streaming audio are evolving with better measurement, why AI-generated ad creative is getting devalued by consumers, and why more brands are now matching or exceeding Meta spend with podcasts. Grant breaks down concepts like spike-level analysis, how radio attribution is becoming more measurable, and why “opt-in” environments (like podcasts) create a different kind of trust than algorithm-fed feeds.Grant DurandoYou’ll learn:00:00 Intro & Grant Durando Background05:11 Why “Offline” Marketing Is No Longer Unmeasurable06:04 Bringing Podcasts Into MMM & Attribution Models07:19 How Radio Finally Became Trackable09:44 Spike-Level Attribution Explained (Radio & Audio)11:06 Where AI Helps in Marketing Ops (And Where It Doesn’t)16:26 Why Bottom-Funnel Tactics Are Losing Impact17:46 The Shift to Podcasts as Top-Funnel Trust Channels20:22 Why Podcast Ads Feel Like Support, Not Interruption24:26 Opt-In Media vs Algorithmic Feeds (Meta, TV, CTV)26:02 Hyper-Personalized Audio Ads & AI-Powered Audio Targeting28:04 What’s Changed Most in Offline Marketing Over Time29:13 How to Work With Grant & Right Side Up30:01 Why Right Side Up’s Consulting Model Is Different30:48 Final Thoughts & Closing Reflections

January 19, 202632 min

Peter Grafe and the “What To Do Next” Engine

What if your marketing measurement didn’t just tell you what happened—but actually told you what to do next? In this episode, I’m joined by Peter Grafe, co-founder of Blue Alpha, to break down what they’re building: an action system for marketing that combines media mix modeling (MMM), incrementality testing, and AI agents to deliver real-time insights and campaign-level budget recommendations.We dig into why MMM is making a comeback (privacy, tracking limits, offline + brand spend), why deterministic attribution isn’t enough, and how Blue Alpha bridges the gap between “You should increase YouTube spend” and the real operational question: which campaigns, how much, and under what constraints? Peter also shares how their anomaly detection agents spot things like creative fatigue, how business goals get infused into “context-aware” recommendations, and why the future of search + discovery (AIO/SEO) pushes marketers up-funnel, whether they like it or not.If you care about customer experience, data-driven insights, adaptability, AI, and business growth, this one is packed with practical frameworks and a clear mental model for modern marketing measurement. Tune in and let me know what you think: are you ready for marketing analytics that actually executes?Peter Grafehttps://www.linkedin.com/in/ped-grafe/

December 16, 202550 min

Inside Customer Obsessed Brands with CX Joe

What happens when a lifelong English major turns thousands of customer conversations into a data-driven playbook for business growth?In this episode of Numbers and Narratives, we sit down with Joe Gilgoff (CX Joe) to unpack a career that spans early-stage startups, breakout consumer brands like AG1, Daily Harvest, and SeatGeek, and a bold leap into entrepreneurship. Joe shares how he transformed unstructured customer data into actionable insights, and why customer experience isn’t a cost center, but a growth engine.We explore how customer-centric cultures are built, how AI is reshaping customer support without replacing humanity, and what founders can do from day one to turn CX into a competitive advantage. From hiring the right talent to making customer-first decisions when the numbers don’t immediately add up, this conversation blends strategy, storytelling, and real-world lessons.Joe Gilgoff https://www.linkedin.com/in/joe-gilgoff-9415bb5b/----------------------------------------------------------------------00:00 From English Major to CX Leader04:55 The First Customer Calls That Changed Everything09:40 Why Customer Experience Drives Growth14:45 Inside Iconic Consumer Brands19:05 Customer Obsession vs Marketing Hype23:35 The CX Playbook That Scales28:50 Hiring Humans Who Get the Customer33:45 AI and the Future of CX38:10 When the Tie Goes to the Customer43:00 Building CX Joe and the Trusted Advisor Model

December 1, 202555 min

Jason Katz: The CX Pain Points That Spark Innovation

How do you scale customer support from 10 people to more than 2,300—while keeping humanity, psychology, and operational excellence at the center? In today’s episode, we sit down with Jason Katz, former early Peloton leader and now founder of Lentil Labs, to explore how customer experience transforms when technology, empathy, and data-driven insights collide.Jason shares the wild hypergrowth journey of Peloton’s support team, the surprising lessons he learned rebuilding their entire support tech stack, and why he believes the future of CX is defined by operational efficiency, AI-assisted support, customer psychology, and intentional service design. We talk through the “peak-end rule,” how brands can engineer memorable customer moments, the right (and wrong) ways to use AI for delight, and why internal tools, not customer-facing ones, often determine whether teams deliver a 5-star experience.You’ll also hear about Jason’s new company, Lentil Labs, and his mission to build lean, powerful CX tools that fill the 15–25% “gap” every support team still feels, even with best-in-class platforms.----------------------------------------------------00:00 – Intro02:40 – Why Jason is only now on Numbers and Narratives04:20 – Peloton rocket ship: scaling support from 10 to 2,300 agents08:30 – Lentil Labs: why support teams still need that extra 15–25%12:00 – CSAT vs cost: what really matters in modern support ops13:10 – The Peak-End Rule: Kahneman, cold water, and remembered pain21:40 – Designing support journeys: peaks, friction, and AI handoffs31:40 – Surprise & delight.46:40 – Using AI to detect peaks, trigger escalations, and support your team52:30 – Ending well: service recovery, positive endings, and Jason’s final advice

November 24, 202531 min

How Generalist Marketers Win With AI

What happens when you treat vinyl not just as music, but as an asset class? In this episode of Numbers and Narratives, we sit down with Cory Huff, a self-described technology nerd and marketing enthusiast who helped build recommendation engines at Discogs, the world’s largest music marketplace. We dig into how hardcore vinyl collectors think, why “collection value” matters more than taste, and what that means for building smarter recommendation systems in a world of rare pressings, promos, and blood-infused records.From there, we zoom out into Cory’s career as a T-shaped marketer across B2B and B2C, from music and fine art to his current role as Director of Marketing at Andrews Cooper, a B2B engineering services firm building everything from automated eyelash machines to a phone-battery-powered defibrillator. We also talk about the “bike shed problem” in marketing, the danger of overstuffed job descriptions, why so many marketers are scared to ship bold ideas, and how to build data-driven, AI-powered workflows without losing the human judgment that makes campaigns actually resonate. If you care about marketing ops, recommendation engines, AI, and building a truly cross-functional career, this one’s for you.https://www.linkedin.com/in/coryhuff/

November 17, 202534 min

From Zero to Billions: The Data Loops Behind Growth

Every marketer (and probably every finance leader) have wondered how incrementally valuable their work is. Colette Nataf got to experience that question, on both sides of the coin.- Unlimited budget (not a joke)- $0 in Facebook Ads spend (also not a joke)Colette is one of the best leaders in the growth marketing space. And she does that while navigating the extremely tough (and regulated) healthcare space.Check out this episode to learn:- How to do customer research THE RIGHT WAY- Where your performance marketing dollars should be going - The wild story about buying your company BACKhttps://lightninggtm.com/https://www.linkedin.com/in/colettenataf

November 10, 202534 min

Hiring for Curiosity: The Skills AI Can’t Replace

This week, we sit down with Liz Reeves, Director of Client Care Operations at a North Carolina-based healthcare software company backed by Bertelsmann, to unpack a deceptively simple question: how do you use AI to reduce admin work without diluting the human experience? We go deep on “human first, human last,” the realities of a highly regulated industry, and why agentic AI belongs behind the scenes—freeing teams to spend more time with customers and clinicians, not less.Liz shares how her org supports everything post-sale (customer education, community, chat, quality, and tooling for CS, Support & ProServ), plus concrete ways AI is elevating sales outreach (data-driven “next best” motions), implementation (shorter time-to-value), and support (less swivel-chair, more relationships). We also dig into hiring for the next five years—resiliency, intellectual agility, and relentless curiosity over narrow hard skills—and the downstream impact: when you remove administrative burden, patients ultimately benefit. Cameos include Sean’s ultramarathons, Klarna’s course correction on AI, and Lucy the very good dog. If you’re thinking about AI in healthcare, customer experience, or building fast-moving post-sale teams, this one’s for you.

November 3, 202541 min

Reddit, AI, and the New Rules of Customer Insight

What happens when cutting-edge AI meets customer experience in some of the world’s most highly regulated industries? In this episode, we sit down with Sarah York, Chief Experience Officer and Fractional CMO, to unpack how AI is reshaping the way companies connect with their customers from startups to established enterprises.Sarah shares how data-driven insights and automation can elevate the customer journey without losing the human touch. We explore how brands like Chewy use personalization to turn routine interactions into moments of delight, why building with data in mind is essential, and how AI audits and benchmarking can transform marketing efficiency.We also dive into the evolution of marketing, from affiliate networks to influencer partnerships, from Google to Reddit, and how generational shifts are redefining where and how customers engage. Plus, Sarah reveals how to use AI responsibly in content and lead generation without losing authenticity.If you’re passionate about the future of AI, marketing, and customer experience, this one’s for you.Subscribe for more data-driven conversations on Numbers and Narratives — where insight meets impact.https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahyorktx/

October 27, 202547 min

AI is giving us Ted Lasso energy

In this episode of Numbers and Narratives, we sit down with Hannah Carlson, founder of Inertia Growth, to explore how AI and automation are transforming the way companies operate, sell, and scale. Hannah breaks down how smaller teams can now compete with giants by working smarter, not harder, using automation, AI-powered insights, and smarter workflows to fuel growth. We dig into how marketing, sales, and creative roles are evolving, and how to balance human intuition with machine intelligence to build scalable, sustainable businesses.If you’re curious about the future of work, AI-driven marketing, or how to turn automation into a competitive advantage, this conversation is for you. Tune in to learn how to leverage AI to grow faster, think bigger, and stay ahead of the curve.Hannah Carlsonhttps://www.linkedin.com/in/hjcarlson/

September 8, 202537 min

The Future of Work: Why the Bar Just Raised

In this illuminating episode of Numbers and Narratives, hosts Ibby Syed and Sean Collins sit down with Justin Michaud, Director of Customer Care at Life360, to explore the cutting-edge world of AI in customer support. Justin shares his experience leading a team that supports multiple products, including Life360, Tile, and Geobit, and how they've revolutionized their customer service approach using AI.The conversation dives deep into the practical applications of AI in customer support, with Justin revealing that their AI agent handles a staggering 180,000 conversations per month compared to 20-25,000 by human agents. He discusses the strategy behind implementing AI for initial customer contact, emphasizing its effectiveness in handling FAQ-type inquiries while preserving human interaction for more complex issues. Justin also addresses the challenges of customer trust in AI systems and how continuous improvement and dedicated management of these tools are crucial for success.One of the most fascinating insights from the episode is Justin's perspective on the evolving roles within customer support teams. He explains how AI is eliminating lower-level tasks, allowing human agents to focus on more complex, high-touch interactions. This shift is changing the hiring landscape, with a growing emphasis on AI literacy and the ability to leverage tools like ChatGPT in daily work. If you're a CX leader, CS professional, or anyone interested in the future of customer support, this episode offers invaluable insights and practical takeaways. Don't miss out on this engaging discussion. Tune in now to stay ahead of the curve in AI-driven customer service!