If You've Come This Far

Hosted by Shaun Emerson & Chris Lozier

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102

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Oct 2026

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About the show

a podcast where Shaun and Chris simply aim to have authentic conversations with interesting people about what they do to make life more fulfilling and more impactful.

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October 26, 20261 hr 12 min

Old Man Walking Club...A Case Study in Human Connection

During COVID, six childhood friends from West Roxbury tried to reconnect on Zoom. It was a disaster, so they went for a walk instead. Seven years later, they’re still walking five miles every Sunday, and one of them made a documentary about it. Shaun and Chris talk with four members of the Old Man Walking Club: filmmaker and author Michael Connelly, Rad, Peter and Tim. It’s the most guests we’ve ever had on one episode, and the nonstop ribbing proves it. Under the jokes is a serious conversation about what happens when men let friendships fade, and what it takes to bring them back. In this episode: How a failed Zoom call turned into a weekly walk that has lasted seven years Why a walk builds more connection than a round of golf The “roast” culture: nothing is off limits, and they still make room for the hard stuff Peter’s Sunday “control-alt-delete” and what it does for the rest of his week Climbing Croagh Patrick in Ireland, and moving from childhood buddies to something closer to brothers Getting Robert Waldinger (Harvard Study of Adult Development) and Dan Pink into the film, plus the wives’ side of the story Writing your own obituary, learning to say yes, and Tim finishing all 48 of New Hampshire’s 4,000-footers Our three closing questions, answered by four guests Shoutout: Former guest Sam Pressler of Connective Tissue co-authored Nobody to Call , a report on men without college degrees. Almost half of the men interviewed reported having no close friends. Join us: We’re hosting a screening of Old Man Walking Club on November 16 at the AMC Rosemont in Rosemont, IL, with a Q&A with the guys afterward. [event link] Sponsor: Mental – getmental.com Learn more about MenLiving at menliving.org .

October 13, 20261 hr 26 min

Victor Matheson...The Economics of Sport

Dr. Victor Matheson, a professor of economics at the College of the Holy Cross, joins Shaun and Chris for a pragmatic look at the intersection of sports, money, and societal impact. From the reality of billionaire owners demanding taxpayer-funded stadiums to the exploitation of student-athletes by the NCAA, Victor cuts through the noise with empirical data and heterodox perspectives. The conversation also explores the explosive growth of legalized sports gambling—now a $180 billion industry—and the hidden societal costs of addiction and unregulated prediction markets. Highlights The economics of stadium subsidies and why owners push for new taxpayer-funded facilities every 30 years when their leases expire. Why the traditional amateurism model in college sports functioned as an exploitative cartel that extracted wealth from young athletes. The structural differences between American closed-league sports and European soccer, and why it is harder to run a profitable team abroad. The staggering rise of legal sports betting from $5 billion to $180 billion, and its correlation with financial distress. The dangerous rise of prediction markets like Polymarket and Kalshi, which mimic sports betting without the same consumer protections or state oversight.

October 1, 20261 hr 10 min

John Wasik…Curious and Tireless

John Wasik is a journalist, public servant, and author of 19 books, whose work spans economics, environmentalism, and community action. Raised in the South suburbs of Chicago with deep roots in the steel mills, Wasik brings a pragmatic and empirical approach to tackling existential threats like climate change and local governance. In this 100th milestone episode, John discusses his journey from a young reporter to a Lake County Commissioner, emphasizing the importance of local infrastructure, integral ecology, and staying engaged with the world through writing and music. He shares how heterodox thinking and community organizing can challenge broken systems and lead to meaningful environmental stewardship. Highlights The South Side Roots (approx. 05:00): John shares his family's history in the steel mills and how growing up in the South suburbs of Chicago shaped his worldview and work ethic. Cognitive Dissonance and Climate Change (approx. 20:00): An exploration of the existential threat of global warming and why society struggles to reconcile psychological anchors with necessary environmental action. Local Action and Property Taxes (approx. 35:00): How grassroots community organizing and challenging local property tax structures led to meaningful political engagement and environmental conservation in Lake County. Integral Ecology (approx. 45:00): John discusses Pope Francis's concept of integral ecology, emphasizing that humanity is not separate from nature, but an active part of the biosphere. The Power of Curiosity (approx. 55:00): Advice on maintaining a lifelong practice of asking questions, journaling, and embracing creative outlets like bluegrass music. Resources John's Substack page Refinement Mental app (for men's mental health and habits)

September 8, 20261 hr 17 min

Rob Bronstein…Building Legacy Beyond the Bottom Line

Rob Bronstein, Founder and President of The Scion Group, joins Shaun Emerson and Chris Lozier for Episode 99 of If You've Come This Far . Beginning his real estate career on 100% commission in Chicago, Rob launched Scion in his mid-20s and scaled it into the nation’s largest private owner and operator of off-campus student housing, managing nearly 120,000 beds across 190 properties. Grounded in empiricism, focus, and tenacity, Rob shares his pragmatic journey of expanding a multi-billion-dollar enterprise while demonstrating how commercial scale serves as an exponential multiplier for social impact. Beyond property operations, Rob highlights Scion’s proactive approach to resident wellbeing, including appointing leadership team members dedicated to student mental health at a systemic level. He also details his philanthropic leadership with the University of Michigan’s pre-seed innovation fund, the youth anti-cyberbullying foundation Buckets Over Bullying , and Tech-Safe Learning (TLC), proving that lasting personal fulfillment stems from building institutions that outlive you. Highlights: Catalyzing University Innovation: How pre-seed philanthropic venture funds bridge the gap between academic research and commercial enterprise at the University of Michigan. The Power of Commission Sales & Autonomy: Why starting on 100% commission builds the grit and risk tolerance required to launch a company at age 25. Cross-Industry Scaling: Elevating student housing operations by recruiting senior leadership from Disney, Caesars, and Wall Street. Systematizing Security & Student Wellness: Why managing 120,000 beds requires dedicated executive leadership in community safety and mental health support. Multiplier-Effect Philanthropy: Leveraging partnerships with the NBA, AAU, and digital influencers to combat youth cyberbullying through Buckets Over Bullying . Resources: The Scion Group Buckets Over Bullying University of Michigan Innovation Partnerships Lead Dad by Paul Sullivan

August 28, 20261 hr 3 min

Susan Herrmann...Breaking Free from Dominator Culture

Susan Herman, LCSW, is a veteran clinical social worker with over three decades of experience spanning child welfare, residential treatment, military social work, and international healing initiatives in Vietnam. In this episode of If You’ve Come This Far , Susan joins Chris and Shaun to discuss her book, Breaking Up with the Patriarchy , and why true personal fulfillment requires deconstructing our relationship with dominant cultural norms. Rather than framing patriarchy solely as male dominance, Susan defines it as a 10,000-year-old "dominator worldview"—a framework built on fear, hyper-individualism, competition, and consumption. Drawing on Indigenous wisdom, clinical practice, and her own transformative life experiences, Susan offers a practical, pragmatic roadmap toward a kinship-centered worldview grounded in radical presence, bodily intuition, reciprocity, and long-term stewardship for future generations. Key Takeaways: The Abusive Relationship with Our Worldview: Why the 10,000-year-old dominator paradigm traps us in a cycle of compliance, consumption, and empty achievement. Early Roots of Empathy: How childhood encounters with Holocaust survivors and early callings shaped Susan’s lifelong dedication to healing. Sovereignty Over Authority: Moving away from outsourcing authority to institutions, and stepping into personal sovereignty paired with relational accountability. Reimagining Needs: Comparing Maslow’s hierarchy with the Blackfoot Nation’s framework of self-actualization, community actualization, and 7th-generation perpetuity. Fear vs. Intuition: Why most fears are socially programmed to maintain the status quo, and how body-centered practices (Tai Chi, Qigong, Yoga) release stored trauma. Duty to Purpose: Shifting daily existence from "have to" (duty/obligation) to "get to" (purpose/meaning). Musical Closing: Susan shares a live, heartfelt rendition of the Prayer of St. Francis. Resources Mentioned: Susan's book: Breaking Up with the Patriarchy The Hope Effect by Dr. Stephen Trzeciak Making Peace with Vietnam (Documentary film by Stephen Emanuel) Research by Four Arrows (Don Trent Jacobs) & Darcia Narvaez on Indigenous Worldviews Mental App ( getmental.com )

August 12, 20261 hr 7 min

Alexandra Friedman...The Lost Art of Friendship

After eighteen years away from the Pacific Northwest, former AWS tech marketer Alexandra "Alex" Friedman returned home to find that professional achievement was no safeguard against profound urban isolation. Confronting the notorious "Seattle Freeze" and the reality of adult loneliness, she began inviting strangers to rooftop dinner parties. That grassroots experiment quickly evolved into Connection Feast, an international community platform and friendship coaching methodology that has brought thousands together for semi-structured, authentic connection. In this episode of If You’ve Come This Far , Alex joins Chris and Shaun to dissect the mechanics of modern belonging. Moving beyond superficial networking and high-pressure dating paradigms, Alex shares why authentic community requires intentional friction, how somatic awareness disarms our biological fear of rejection, and why building platonic intimacy—especially among men—is essential for mental health and personal fulfillment. Key Highlights "Connectivities" vs. Dating Pressure: Why structured, action-oriented activities create psychological safety and draw men into deeper conversations far more effectively than traditional mixers. Boundaries Create Freedom: How establishing curated dinner themes and structured conversational rules helps introverts bypass small talk and open up quickly. Customer Obsession to People Obsession: The catalyst behind leaving big tech to build a business around social health and relational infrastructure. The Evolutionary Logic of Rejection: Why social exclusion feels like physical danger to the nervous system, and practical somatic tools to regulate through anxiety. The Danger of Frictionless Connection: Why AI chatbots and one-sided digital interactions cannot substitute for the messy, indispensable growth of real-world relationships. The Solo Strategy: Why showing up alone to recurring, shared-goal groups over 3–6 months is the most empirical path to making lasting adult friends. Resources Mentioned Substack: Come A Little Further Connection Feast: ConnectionFeast.com U.S. Chamber of Connection: ChamberofConnection.org MenLiving: MenLiving.org The Path / Mental: GetMental.com Literature & Media: Bowling Alone (Robert Putnam / Pete Davis documentary)

July 29, 20261 hr 20 min

Mark Ishaug...Lead with Love, Get Stuff Done

Mark Ishaug has spent his career at the forefront of mission-driven advocacy and community healthcare. Before serving as the CEO of Thresholds--one of Illinois's largest and oldest providers of mental health and substance use recovery services--Mark spent two decades leading public policy and executive efforts at the AIDS Foundation of Chicago and AIDS United. Inspired early in life by his mother’s civil rights activism and cemented by personal tragedy--losing his 29-year-old brother, Eric, to undiagnosed mental illness and substance use--Mark has dedicated his life to creating tangible social impact for society's most vulnerable. In this episode of If You've Come This Far , Mark joins Chris and Shaun to unpack how love and power must intersect to build sustainable, high-impact organizations. He shares how Thresholds provides "Home, Health, and Hope" to over 13,000 individuals annually through supportive housing, mobile crisis response, and comprehensive behavioral health clinics. Grounded in pragmatism and deep empathy, Mark discusses the critical need to protect healthcare access, eradicate systemic stigma, and foster genuine human connection in an increasingly disconnected world. Highlights Defining Love as an Action and Business Foundation: How leading with love translates directly into organizational operations, listening to those on the margins, and driving systemic change. Personal Tragedy & The Mission Behind Thresholds: Mark opens up about losing his younger brother Eric at age 29, and how that personal loss fuels his commitment to mental healthcare reform. "Home, Health, and Hope": The Scope of Thresholds: A look into how Thresholds operates 1,600+ housing units and Certified Community Behavioral Health Clinics (CCBHCs) to keep individuals supported in their communities. Navigating Policy Challenges & Systemic Threats: Examining the impact of Medicaid redeterminations and threats to the "Housing First" model on safety-net providers. "We Show Up": Love in Action: How frontline caseworkers operationalized compassionate care through severe heatwaves, COVID-19, and daily community outreach. Resources Mentioned Thresholds AIDS Foundation of Chicago Bowling Alone by Robert Putnam Festival! (Podcast) & Join or Die (Documentary) by Pete Davis Sponsor: Mental App

July 13, 20261 hr 8 min

Matthew Quick...Radical Acts of Love

Matthew Quick returns to If You've Come This Far for his second appearance on the show to discuss his new memoir, Dad, Love, Me . In a raw conversation, Matthew opens up about his father’s battle with dementia, his own journey through sobriety, and the grueling but beautiful process of Jungian analysis. Offering an unfiltered look at generational trauma, he discusses the courageous choice to love a parent exactly as they are, without demanding they earn it. Pragmatic and deeply moving, this episode explores the profound impact of showing up, making peace with the past, and creating new narratives for the future. Highlights: Defining love as a choice to embrace someone in the present moment without needing them to earn it, particularly in the face of dementia. Breaking the cycle of father-son violence by making a conscious decision not to pass on inherited trauma to the next generation. The healing power of Jungian analysis and the importance of experiencing positive, altruistic male friendships. The difficult reality of writing a vulnerable memoir without family support and dealing with the tradition of secrecy in traumatized families. The feminization of reading and the critical need for older men to mentor younger men and guide them back to literature. Resources: Dad, Love, Me by Matthew Quick Mental app ( getmental.com ) Joe Conrad's new book Man Therapy: Therapy the Way a Man Does It

June 30, 20261 hr 6 min

Ron Dresher & Brian Harris...Balancing Life

In this episode of If You've Come This Far , Chris and Shaun sit down with Ron Dresher and Brian Harris, founders of the Los Angeles-based Life Transition Group. Approaching their 80s with the metabolic age and energy of men decades younger, Ron and Brian share how they built a thriving community designed to help men navigate the often-daunting shift out of full-time careers. They discuss the critical need for connection, empirical learning, and purpose in later life, emphasizing that retirement isn't just about financial readiness—it's about holistic well-being. Grounded in pragmatism and lived experience, the conversation explores the "CHAIRS" framework—Charity, Health, Achievement, Independence, Relationships, and Spirituality—as a practical guide for balancing our priorities through all of life's chapters. From the importance of giving back to the community to fostering deep, vulnerable friendships, Ron and Brian offer a pragmatic blueprint for aging gracefully, intentionally, and joyfully. Highlights: [04:12] The origins of the Life Transition Group and the realization that many men lack a roadmap for retirement beyond finances. [07:15] Breaking down the "CHAIRS" framework. [11:05] Why soft skills, such as nurturing relationships and maintaining spirituality, become crucial growth areas for aging men. [33:14] The concept of chronological age vs. metabolic age, and the critical difference between lifespan, healthspan, and "joyspan." [48:10] Ron's personal "GRAMPS" blueprint for life balance and his advice to his 10-year-old self about the paramount importance of relationships. Resources: Helen Dennis : Syndicated columnist and expert on aging and the new retirement. Dr. Michael Greger : Physician and author of How Not to Age and How Not to Die . PreNuvo : Preventative health and full-body MRI screening. GetMental : App designed to help men strengthen their mindset and achieve discipline.

June 15, 20261 hr 3 min

From the Vault: Fr. Michael Himes on Love

In this "From the Vault" episode, Chris and Shaun are joined by MenLiving co-founder Todd Adams to reflect on the teachings of the late Father Michael Himes, a beloved Notre Dame and Boston College professor whom Chris considers the wisest person he’s ever known. Anchored by audio clips from Father Himes's beautiful "Last Lecture," the trio explores what it means to live a deeply meaningful life and the urgency of sharing our most authentic truths before our time runs out. They discuss integrity, giving one's self, uttering the definitive message, and more. Before diving into the vault, Chris also takes a moment to highlight real leadership by shouting out Chris "Chowdah" Hill on his promotion to Rear Admiral. Chowdah's focus on mental health, positive relationships, and mission aboard the USS Dwight D. Eisenhower serves as a modern, pragmatic example of the very principles Father Himes spent his life teaching. Resources Mentioned: Father Michael Himes's "Last Lecture" at Boston College The Way of the Warrior Sailor by Rear Admiral Chris "Chowdah" Hill MenLiving (Co-founded by Todd Adams) This episode is brought to you by Judson & Moore, Family Legacy American Whiskey. Born from Boundless Curiosity. Learn more about Judson & Moore here