Experts On The Wire (An SEO Podcast!)

Hosted by Dan Shure (SEO)

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140

Latest episode

Jun 2026

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EN-US

About the show

Downloaded over 750,000 times! Experts On The Wire is an SEO podcast hosted by Dan Shure. Discover new trends, tactics, tools, people, and businesses doing remarkable work in the world of Search Engine Optimization. Past guests include Rand Fishkin, Brian Dean, Annie Cushing, Noah Kagan & Vanessa Fox. I’m an SEO consultant myself, so we dig deep into SEO, technical challenges, growth stories, mobile SEO, eCommerce, crawling, content marketing & more.

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June 1, 2026Episode 51 hr 4 min

Keywordless Targeting, IndexNow, What SEOs Should Learn From PPCs w/Navah Hopkins of Microsoft

SEOs and PPCs need to talk more and learn from each other. For example, did you know you can actually connect Search Console to Google Ads from within the Ads reporting?? No? I didn't either until this week's guest told me about it... learn that, and a ton more in this great conversation.Navah Hopkins is Microsoft's Ad Liaison, an International Speaker, answer's questions in SEJ's monthly column called Ask The PPC and has been in marketing, PPC and SEO for 17+ years.This episode was recorded ⁠with Riverside⁠ which has sped up my podcast process ten fold and why I am now able to publish more episodes again.Reach me at dan at ⁠evolvingseo.com⁠ for SEO, AI Search or YouTube Visibility ConsultingLinks and resources mentioned:https://blogs.bing.com/webmaster/February-2026/Introducing-AI-Performance-in-Bing-Webmaster-Tools-Public-Previewhttps://about.ads.microsoft.com/en/blog/post/april-2026/win-across-all-three-eras-of-the-webhttps://www.searchenginejournal.com/ask-a-ppc-how-to-make-microsoft-advertising-profitable/549643/https://searchengineland.com/google-microsoft-performance-max-approaches-464964https://clarity.microsoft.com/Chapters (⁠auto generated by Riverside⁠):00:00 Understanding Keywordless Targeting03:01 The Role of Landing Pages in PPC07:06 Navah's Journey and Current Role at Microsoft11:10 Debunking Myths About Microsoft Advertising14:18 The Future of Landing Pages16:30 Gathering Intelligence from PMAX Campaigns20:22 Connecting SEO and PPC for Better Insights29:54 Convergence of Brand and Performance in AI30:20 The Role of AI in Brand Discovery32:34 Understanding Conversion Paths in AI33:56 Importance of Product Catalogs and Reviews37:09 Navigating Feeds and Merchant Centers39:38 Setting Up for AI Commerce40:07 Accessibility and AI Compliance44:25 The Necessity of Video Content46:57 The Future of Content in AI49:36 Collaboration Between SEO and PPC51:14 Understanding Prompt Data and User Engagement54:37 The Future of Websites and Agentic Scenarios59:36 Exciting Features in Microsoft Ads

April 16, 2026Episode 428 min

The "ALL Method" for AI Search Content Optimization (On page optimization for LLM Visibility)

An on-page content optimization method I've been testing with clients that's ACTUALLY different than "just SEO". This episode is for anyone looking to optimize their content (blog posts, product pages, landing pages, etc) - for LLM Visibility - without throwing away your SEO.This episode recorded and produced in under one hour! (all in one take! props to the host for that 😬) with Riverside which has sped up my podcast process ten fold and why I am now able to publish more again.Semrush study on ChatGPT Traffic and usage: https://www.semrush.com/blog/chatgpt-search-insights/Myriam Jessier's LinkedIn Post about user behavior changes in LLMs vs Search EnginesReach me at dan at evolvingseo.com for SEO, AI Search or YouTube Visibility ConsultingChapters (auto generated by Riverside):00:00 Introduction to AI and SEO Optimization03:04 Understanding Human Behavior in AI Search05:54 The ALL Method for AI Search Optimization11:56 Layering Key Elements into Content17:52 Practical Applications and Final ThoughtsThis description area contains affiliate links which may offer discounts to you and/or are free to you to use and provide me with a small commission which helps support Experts on the Wire.

March 30, 2026Episode 41 hr 9 min

Jenny Halasz: Google Is Going To Win The AI Race, Invest In SEO or Get Left Behind

Jump to the 11:00 minute mark for SEO-specific info! (We spent a little time talking about consulting vs agencies and the climate of doing SEO/work first!)Jenny is a Principal Advisor & Senior SEO at New Media Advisors, with expertise in e-commerce, hospitality, financial, pharma, education, B2B and an International Speaker. She is author of the new book, AI-Powered Content Marketing - get a 35% off discount here!.... International listeners can get the book here.The SEOchat reboot on LinkedIn Can be found here! https://www.linkedin.com/groups/17836011/Jenny on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennyhalasz/Work with me on SEO, AI Search, YouTube and Organic Visibility: https://www.evolvingseo.com/"Why Google Will Win The Agentic eCommerce Race" article mentionedChapters (auto-generated with Riverside)00:00 Consulting Landscape and Personal Struggles02:13 New Media Advisors: A Consultative Approach05:16 The Agency vs. Consultant Dilemma07:55 Navigating Client Acquisition Challenges11:00 E-commerce Marketing Strategies13:58 Understanding Entity Relationships in SEO17:06 Budget Allocation for E-commerce and B2C Marketing19:57 The Future of AI in Marketing22:48 The Evolution of AI and Search Engines26:09 The Role of Content Marketing in the AI Era30:51 Understanding Zero Click Searches34:09 Measuring SEO Success Beyond Clicks38:58 Demystifying AI in Marketing43:53 Debunking SEO Myths45:21 The Risks of Using LLMS.txt47:38 Content Optimization for AI and LLMs50:22 Understanding Trustworthiness in AI51:29 Holistic Topic Clustering in SEO53:12 Integrating SEO with LLM Strategies56:48 Client Relationships and Agency Dynamics01:00:32 Navigating Industry Changes and AI Impact01:03:17 The Commoditization of SEO and Its Challenges

March 23, 2026Episode 31 hr 11 min

Nils Reimers: What Do SEOs Have Right (and Wrong) About AI & LLM Optimization?

Too many SEOs are guessing (or worse spreading known misinformation for LinkedIn clout) about what actually helps being cited in LLMs like ChatGPT, Claude, Perplexity, Gemini etc.Let's stop doing that - I wanted to talk to Nils Reimers, the inventor of "Sentence BERT" and an expert in LLMs, natural language processing and more to sort out truth from fiction.LOTS covered in this episode!Nils Bio (via Claude)Nils Reimers is the inventor of Sentence BERT, the research breakthrough that made semantic search scalable and now underpins how companies like Google, Netflix, and OpenAI understand and retrieve information. He currently works at Cohere, where he focuses on building large language models for enterprise use cases, including custom multilingual models for global companies like Fujitsu and LG.Work with me on SEO, AI Search, YouTube and Organic Visibility: ⁠https://www.evolvingseo.com/⁠Covered this episode! Chapters auto generated by Riverside:00:00 The State of SEO in the Age of LLMs12:08 Understanding BERT and Sentence BERT21:41 SEO Strategies for the Future28:42 Cohere and Multilingual Embeddings34:14 Re-Rank Models and Their Impact35:31 Balancing Speed and Quality in SEO36:01 Optimizing Content for LLMs39:32 Engagement vs. Directness in Content40:30 The Evolution of SEO Practices43:32 The Challenge of AI-Generated Content46:51 The Role of Schema and Structured Data48:37 Understanding LLMs.txt and Its Relevance50:14 The Problem of Training Data Quality52:40 The Potential of Video and Audio Sources55:17 Strategic Shifts for Businesses in the AI Era01:00:03 The Future of Jobs in an AI-Driven World01:05:36 AI Tools and Their Impact on Work

March 16, 2026Episode 21 hr 14 min

Luca Cian: How Humans Interact With AI & What That Means for Business Strategy

Luca Cian is AI Strategy & Psychology Expert. He is a Full Professor at the Darden School of Business, and an Advisor to the U.S. DHS on AI Strategy.His speciality is decoding how humans interact with AI and what that means for business strategy. Luca's findings on AI trust and consumer psychology have been featured in The New York Times, USA Today, PBS, The Washington Post, NPR, and Harvard Business Review.Subscribe to 'Experts' anywhere by searching 'Experts on the Wire' (and exciting news, we'll be on YouTube soon! You can find the channel for now, and as soon as YouTube let's me the podcast will be available there).Work with me on SEO, AI Search, YouTube and Organic Visibility: ⁠https://www.evolvingseo.com/⁠Episode Chapters (autogenerated with Riverside)00:00 The Rise of AI and Human Interaction05:54 Defining AI: Perceptions and Misconceptions11:53 Trusting AI: Psychological Insights and Barriers17:48 Consumer Trust: Factors Influencing AI Acceptance23:55 A-B Testing and Research Methodologies in AI29:46 Future of AI: Personalities and Business Implications36:09 Exploring AI in Consumer Research36:53 Understanding the Word of Machine Effect40:54 Trusting AI: Utilitarian vs. Hedonic Choices42:52 AI in Content Creation: Balancing Transparency and Trust48:54 Algorithmic Transference: The Impact of AI Failures51:03 SEO Strategies in the Age of AI51:58 The Future of Content: Human vs. AI Optimization57:40 Value-Driven Brands in an AI World01:00:52 The Future of Jobs in an AI-Driven Economy01:04:55 Experiential Marketing: The Human Connection01:09:47 AI Tools and Their Impact on Daily Life

March 15, 2026Episode 110 min

Experts on the Wire Reboots! What To Expect

We're back! With video! This is a short re-intro from Dan on the exact 10 year anniversary of the original launch of Experts on the Wire. In this short episode I talk about why the re-boot and what to expect.Be sure to subscribe, first new episode is tomorrow March 16th, 2026! We are on Spotify, Apple, and all podcast players - and will be on YouTube very soon! (As soon I can find my login to an account I must have created years ago and never used 🤔)Chapters (auto generated by Riverside):0:00 - Introduction: Experts on the Wire is back with new twists, including video integration.0:29 - Podcast History: Reflecting on the podcast's launch 10 years ago and the decision to reboot.0:59 - Technical Challenges: Discussing the technical difficulties faced in the past.1:51 - Modernizing the Process: How AI and new platforms have streamlined podcast production.2:13 - Burnout and SEO: Personal and industry-related reasons for the podcast's hiatus.3:22 - SEO's Identity Crisis: Exploring the evolving identity of SEO in the age of AI.4:38 - Expanding Guest List: Plans to include guests beyond the SEO bubble, focusing on AI experts.5:56 - Broader Conversations: Aiming to learn from diverse professionals and real-world perspectives.6:26 - Creative Experiments: Introducing creative elements and real-world insights into the podcast.7:24 - Guest Selection: Criteria for selecting guests and the importance of expert insights.8:03 - Podcast Aspirations: Vision for growth and revitalization, inspired by a love for restoration.9:30 - Subscription and Accessibility: How to follow the podcast on various platforms.Work with me on SEO, AI Search, YouTube and Organic Visibility: ⁠⁠https://www.evolvingseo.com/⁠⁠

July 11, 20241 hr 8 min

131: Bias in SEO, Overconfident SEO Case Studies, Google’s SERP Struggles w/Sarah Pokorná

Sarah Pokorná, is Digital Marketing Director at Dragon Metrics. She holds degrees in both Psychology and Digital Marketing and has been doing SEO, Marketing and Psychomarketing in corporate roles for 12 years.As SEOs, I think we spend FAR too much time obsessing over Google ‘Ranking Factors’ (most recently the API leaks) and NOT enough time trying to actually understand and empathize with searchers – the people we are supposedly making content for and trying to win over in the SERPs. In this conversation, Sarah brings her unique perspective drawing from her background in psychology to help unpack some of the psychological perspectives searchers have – particularly cognitive biases.If you want to gain a deeper understanding and get into the minds of the people who search Google – the same people who traffic websites and ultimately drive revenue and business goals for sites and businesses – this episode is definitely worth a listen!Topics In This Episode:Cognitive Biases in SearchWhy were AI Overviews such a miss for Google?The importance of fact-checking for SEO contentSearch and Social Impacts on the Nervous SystemHow did biases impact how the SEO world reacted to Google’s API Leaks?Biases like Confirmation Bias in SEO Case StudiesWhy do overconfident people actually believe they are good at SEO?Should Google play a role in preventing misinformation?What else can we as SEOs do to understand searchers better?And much more – listen now!Related Episodes You Might Like127: Image Optimization, Algorithmic Biases, ADHD & SEO w/Myriam Jessier097: Improve Your SEO With Keyword Psychographics w/Marty WeintraubArticles, Resources, and Linkshttps://www.dragonmetrics.com/confirmation-bias/https://www.sarahpresch.com/post/cognitive-biases-in-seoNeurodivergents in SEOGoogle API Leak: Sparktoro’s initial post about itThe Cyber Effect (book about misinformation online)GBH’s Video mentioned re: the Title Update and example of FramingGiulia PanozzoMyriam JessierPetra Kis-HerczeghFind Sarah OnlineSarah on LinkedInSarah on TwitterSarah’s WebsiteThe post 131: Bias in SEO, Overconfident SEO Case Studies, Google’s SERP Struggles w/Sarah Pokorná appeared first on Evolving SEO.

March 13, 20241 hr 15 min

130: The Future of SEO – Optimism In Uncertain Times w/Will Critchlow

Will Critchlow is the CEO of SearchPilot, an SEO A/B testing company. I invited Will back to Experts on the Wire to discuss the Future of SEO. I feel like things have felt very turbulent and uncertain in the SEO world lately (more than usual!) – because of things like AI/Chat-GPT, changes in how the community engages online, GA4, massive SERP changes from Google, and changes in the economy and world at large post-covid.I’ve always known Will for having a great perspective on the future of our industry so I wanted to get his take on what the future of SEO holds. Is THIS finally the inflection moment where ‘SEO is dead’? How does he see the next 5-10 years playing out? If it’s not dying, how will it look different? What should SEOs and businesses be doing to future-proof their marketing? How do we all navigate these big changes?Topics In This Episode Include:How is AI affecting informational queries?What the ancient steel and iron industry has to do with contentIs it worth still investing in content marketing?How is the eCommerce SEO space changing? Is eCommerce and spending online down or is it growing?Challenges for new people entering the SEO spaceAnd lots more…Listen Now!Related Episodes You Might LikeSurviving SEO in an AI World w/Sara TaherSEO Ranking Factors, A/B Testing and the Evolution of SEO w/Will CritchlowTools MentionedChat GPTGeminiSearchPilotContent Aced (50% off – affiliate link)Articles, Resources, and Links Mentionedhttps://www.perplexity.ai/Where Web Users Spend Their Time vs Where Traffic Referrals Originate – SparktoroGoogle Anti-Trust Trial DocumentsWomen in Tech SEOFind Will OnlineWill on LinkedInWill on TwitterThe post 130: The Future of SEO – Optimism In Uncertain Times w/Will Critchlow appeared first on Evolving SEO.

February 20, 20241 hr 16 min

129: Helpful Content Update Recovery and More w/Kristine Schachinger

Kristine Schachinger is an SEO Consultant, specializing in Technical SEO, SEO Website Audits, Growth Strategies, Google Penalty Recovery, Accessibility, Usability, LLMs, & Social Media. She has been an SEO for over 15 years and helped sites like Instacart, Vice, Zappos, usa.gov and many more.Topics In This Episode Include:Why AI vs Human Content Comparison Studies are SillyHow AI has Changed SEOHow Does Google Detect “AI Content”?Deep Dive Into The Helpful Content UpdateGoogle’s Search Generative ExperienceWhy Core Web Vitals Is NOT a Ranking Factor NowE.A.T.T. Myths and Why It’s Not a Ranking Factor, Ranking Signal or Ranking SystemHow To Learn About SEO From “The Source”How To Find and Hire The Right SEO (And how to attract the right clients if you are an SEO)Kristine’s Approach to Providing SEO ConsultingListen Now!Related Episodes You Might LikeSurviving SEO in an AI World with Sara Taher“The Email” (A Solo Episode from 2017 about Google Phantom Update)Tools MentionedMidjourneySitebulbContent Aced (50% off – affiliate link)More being added soon!Articles, Resources, and Links MentionedKristine’s Post About AI vs Human ContentDetecting AI Content with Watermarking (NY Times)Google’s Developer Guide to Ranking SystemsKristine’s Post About “EEAT” on LinkedInMy article from 2020 about EAT and Core UpdatesMore Being Added Soon!Find Kristine OnlineKristine on LinkedIn The post 129: Helpful Content Update Recovery and More w/Kristine Schachinger appeared first on Evolving SEO.

February 20, 20246 min

Updates About This Podcast!

Join me for 5 mins with some updates about Experts on the Wire (and new episode announcements!)Listen Now!Check out Content Aced – a high-powered research assistant tool that helps you find topical gaps in your content: https://www.evolvingseo.com/contentaced for 50% off.The post Updates About This Podcast! appeared first on Evolving SEO.