Deals with Heels

Hosted by Debra Bowers

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140

Latest episode

Oct 2026

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EN-US

About the show

Deals with Heels is a leadership and business podcast for entrepreneurs, executives, and sales leaders who want clarity, confidence, and sustainable growth. Hosted by Debra Bowers, the show explores leadership decision-making, sales psychology, communication, and the human side of business through real conversations and practical insight. Each episode helps listeners lead better, sell with integrity, and build a business that works for real life.

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October 20, 2026Episode 13941 min

When Being Unstoppable Starts Holding You Back with Victoria Pelletier

SUMMARY What happens when the resilience that helped you survive, succeed, and build an extraordinary career starts getting in your way? Victoria Pelletier became a COO at 24, a president by 35, and a CEO at 41. She's a corporate executive, board director, bestselling author, and speaker whose TEDx talk on healthy resilience has reached nearly two million views. But behind those achievements is a much more personal story about adversity, independence, and learning that being strong doesn't always mean pushing through everything alone. In this episode of Deals with Heels, Debra Bowers and Victoria explore the difference between healthy and unhealthy resilience, why high-performing people often struggle to ask for help, and how the qualities that once protected us can eventually become limitations. Victoria shares how she went from being known as the "Iron Maiden" at work to recognizing that vulnerability, emotional openness, and authentic relationships could make her a more effective leader. The conversation also moves into organizational transformation, AI adoption, and the human challenges leaders often overlook. Debra shares a revealing example of employees who appeared to be successfully adopting new technology but were actually finding ways to continue working around it. Together, they explore why dashboards don't always tell the full story, why employees may hesitate to tell leaders what they really think, and why successful transformation requires more than a good strategy or new technology. It's a conversation about leadership, growth, self-awareness, and recognizing when the strengths that brought us this far need to evolve. KEY TOPICS / MAIN IDEAS - How childhood adversity can shape leadership strengths - The difference between healthy and unhealthy resilience - When being unstoppable becomes an expectation you place on yourself - Why high achievers struggle to ask for help - How vulnerability can strengthen leadership and trust - Moving beyond the emotional armor we develop to protect ourselves - Why AI and technology transformations fail without human adoption - What leaders misunderstand about employee resistance to change - Why successful performance doesn't always mean successful technology adoption - The danger of measuring the wrong things - Why employees don't always tell leaders what they really think - The difference between aspirational company values and organizational reality - Why marketing cannot permanently disguise a broken customer experience - How self-awareness and reflection help build healthier resilience - Recognizing when resilience has become unsustainable - Giving yourself permission to fail and grow RESOURCES Connect with Victoria Explore Victoria's executive coaching, consulting, speaking, books, and TEDx talk through her website. Website: https://victoria-pelletier.com YouTube Channel: https://youtube.com/@victoriapelletierunstoppable?si=v8507TIxEyDYNvNF YouTube Speaker Reel: https://youtu.be/na8LwVeWsmE LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/victoriapelletier/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/PelletierV29 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/victoria_pelletier_unstoppable/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Victoria.Pelletier.Unstoppable Medium: https://medium.com/@victoriapelletier Connect with Debra LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Growth Vanguard: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking: https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ Human Sales Playbook: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook Hexagon Media: https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform. 💬 Connect with Debra on LinkedIn and join the conversation. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover the show. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

October 13, 2026Episode 13841 min

What 3,000 Marriage Proposals Taught Ash Fox About Love, Trust & Getting It Right

SUMMARY What can more than 3,000 marriage proposals teach you about love, trust, and creating a moment someone will remember for the rest of their life? Ash Fox never planned to become a marriage proposal expert. She was a fine artist and photographer in New York City when a client asked her to photograph his proposal in Central Park. Then another request came. And another. Before long, Ash realized she wasn't simply documenting proposals—people needed help creating them. Fifteen years later, Ash Fox Proposals has helped more than 3,000 couples plan and capture one of the biggest moments of their lives. In this episode of Deals with Heels, Ash joins Debra Bowers to share what happens behind the scenes of a great proposal, the mistakes people make when they try too hard to create the perfect moment, and why knowing the person you're proposing to matters more than making the experience bigger or more elaborate. Ash also shares what she's learned from working primarily with men during an unusually vulnerable moment, why she now insists on working directly with the person proposing rather than letting well-meaning family members take over, and what happened when the proposal planner herself finally got engaged. It's a fun and revealing look inside a business most people don't even realize exists—and a reminder that the most memorable experiences aren't necessarily the biggest. They're the ones that feel like they were created for you. KEY TOPICS / MAIN IDEAS - How Ash Fox accidentally became a marriage proposal planner - How Instagram helped create demand for proposal photography - What Ash learned after more than 3,000 proposals - Why bigger and more elaborate doesn't always mean more meaningful - Why the best proposals reflect the person receiving them - What happens when family members become too involved in the planning - Why Ash works directly with the person proposing - What men reveal when they're preparing for a major commitment - Why most modern proposals aren't really about whether the answer will be yes - How ritual and romance create meaning even when couples have already discussed marriage - What happened when a professional proposal planner got proposed to - Why knowing your partner is the most important part of planning the moment - How Ash turned an unexpected opportunity into a highly specialized business RESOURCES Connect with Ash Website: https://ashfoxproposals.com/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ashfoxproposals/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ashfoxproposals Ash also hosts The Proposal Podcast and offers one-on-one proposal planning sessions for people who want help developing their proposal idea, whether or not Ash's team ultimately executes the event. Connect with Debra LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Growth Vanguard: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking: https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ Human Sales Playbook: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook Hexagon Media: https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform. 💬 Connect with Debra on LinkedIn and join the conversation. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover the show. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

October 6, 2026Episode 1371 hr 7 min

How Do You Scale What Makes Your Business Special Without Losing It? with Tammy Conover

Summary Being exceptional at what you do and knowing how to build a business around it are two very different things. Sometimes the very thing that makes a business extraordinary is also what makes it difficult to explain, systematize, and scale. In this episode of Deals with Heels, Debra Bowers talks with intuitive abstract artist Tammy Conover about the Soul Painting experience, Tammy’s own healing through art, and what it takes to build a business around something deeply personal without stripping away the connection that makes it valuable. Tammy shares how Soul Paintings began, why the experience is about more than creating a beautiful painting, and how people can continue discovering new meaning in their paintings long after the session ends. Debra and Tammy also go behind the scenes of their work together: moving the experience from an in-person model to a virtual one, preserving Tammy’s creative process, expanding client deliverables, and building systems and technology around the work instead of forcing the work to conform to the technology. The conversation also explores trauma, healing, intuition, confidence, entrepreneurship, and a larger business lesson: sometimes growth doesn’t require changing what makes your business special. It requires protecting it and building everything else around it. Key Topics & Main Ideas - What a Soul Painting experience is - How Tammy’s art became part of her own healing - Why feeling seen, heard, and understood matters - How to scale a deeply personal creative service - What should—and should not—be standardized - Using technology to support human connection rather than replace it - Moving from in-person delivery to a virtual model - Turning existing creative work into stronger client deliverables - Using AI and systems without flattening the human experience - Building confidence around the parts of entrepreneurship that don’t come naturally - Listening to intuition without confusing it with fear or worry - Protecting the thing that makes a business extraordinary RESOURCES Connect with Tammy You can book your own Soul Painting Experience on Tammy's website. Website: https://TammyConoverArt.com LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/tammy-conover-ba36ab159/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/tammyconoverart Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/tammyconoverart/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@tammyconoverart9666 Connect with Debra LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Growth Vanguard: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking: https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ Human Sales Playbook: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook Hexagon Media https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform. 💬 Connect with Debra on LinkedIn and join the conversation. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover the show. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

September 29, 2026Episode 13638 min

What Broadway Can Teach Us About Trust, Teamwork, and Extraordinary Performance with Teri Pruitt

Summary When we experience something extraordinary, we naturally notice the person standing in front of us—the performer, the leader, the person taking the bow. What we rarely see are all the people behind the scenes whose work made that moment possible. For more than 25 years on Broadway, Teri Pruitt has worked in an environment where hundreds of people have to trust one another, adapt when something goes wrong, and consistently create excellence most of the audience will never see. And organizations aren't really that different. In this episode of Deals with Heels, Debra Bowers sits down with Teri, founder of Open the Aperture, to explore what the theatrical process can teach us about leadership, teamwork, communication, trust, recognition, and creating an extraordinary experience. Teri takes us backstage to explain how Broadway productions move from development through technical rehearsals and previews, where teams continuously rehearse, test, adjust, and learn before opening night. Debra and Teri also explore what corporate teams can learn from theatrical improvisation, including using “yes, and” to break down silos, invite ideas, and help people step outside their own perspective. They discuss what happens when a great team's work doesn't produce the expected outcome, why timing and audience readiness matter, and how strong professional communities create relationships that extend far beyond a single production. Because extraordinary performance is rarely created by the person everyone sees. It is built through trust, alignment, respect, empowered teams, and the work happening backstage long before the customer experiences the result. Key Topics & Main Ideas - What Broadway can teach organizations about teamwork and trust - Why extraordinary performance depends on work the audience never sees - How backstage teams experience recognition without standing in the spotlight - Why respect for someone's competence creates a foundation for trust - How a shared goal helps teams work through conflict - What technical rehearsals and Broadway previews can teach businesses about testing and iteration - Using “yes, and” to move teams beyond silos and defensiveness - How changing perspectives can help teams solve difficult problems - Why outrageous ideas sometimes lead to the best practical solutions - The difference between internal competition and collective success - Why a strong performance can still fail when the audience isn't ready - How teams respond to decisions made far above their level of authority - Why professional relationships and community matter over an entire career - How team empowerment affects the experience customers ultimately receive - Why leaders have to build the backstage before customers experience the performance RESOURCES Connect with Teri Pruitt Website: https://www.teripruitt.world LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/teri-pruitt-a2b341101/ Teri also invites listeners interested in her personal work and theater life to connect with her on Facebook and Instagram. Connect with Debra Bowers our Host LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Growth Vanguard: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ Free Resource — 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking: https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ Human Sales Playbook: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook Hexagon Media: https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform so you never miss an episode. 💬 Join the conversation by connecting with Debra on LinkedIn and sharing what resonated with you. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover Deals with Heels and the conversations that can help them grow. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

September 22, 2026Episode 13541 min

Why Knowing What to Do Isn't Enough to Change with Janylène Turcotte

Summary Have you ever known exactly what you needed to do—and still couldn't make yourself do it? You know the boundary you need to set. The habit you need to change. The role you've outgrown. You may even understand why you keep repeating the same pattern, yet somehow you continue making choices from the person you've learned to be rather than the person you're trying to become. In this episode of Deals with Heels, Debra Bowers sits down with executive coach and clinical hypnotherapist Janylène Turcotte, founder of Hypnocoach, to explore the gap between knowing and becoming. Janylène explains why we can remain attached to what is familiar even when it is uncomfortable, how subconscious beliefs influence our choices, and why getting clear about the “why beneath the why” can change the decisions we make. She also introduces a provocative question: What benefit might we be receiving from staying exactly where we are? Debra shares her own experience of mistaking functional freeze for procrastination, learning to regulate herself in real time, rebuilding the capacity to make decisions, and recognizing how scarcity once led her to give away the very strategy and creativity she was trying to sell. Their conversation expands into confidence, value, people-pleasing, relationships, identity, deliberate action, and what happens when the people around us have grown comfortable with an older version of who we were. Together, they explore something at the heart of real transformation: insight can show us what needs to change, but becoming someone new requires us to create new experiences, new evidence, and eventually a new version of what feels familiar. Key Topics & Main Ideas - Why knowing what to do doesn't necessarily create change - Why the familiar can feel safer even when it is unhealthy or uncomfortable - Finding the “why beneath the why” before making major decisions - How subconscious thoughts and beliefs influence behavior - Functional freeze, procrastination, and emotional regulation - Accessible ways to become curious about subconscious thoughts - Why the meaning we attach to an experience may matter more than the experience itself - Capacity, confidence, and trusting ourselves to handle uncertainty - Why we sometimes give away our expertise instead of standing in its value - The hidden benefit behind staying stuck or maintaining the status quo - Scarcity, validation, and the urge to prove our value - Why action can help us discover what we actually want - How deliberate action creates new evidence about who we are becoming - Why old patterns can eventually become less familiar than new ones - What happens to relationships when one person changes - People-pleasing, fawning, and the people who benefited from the old version of us - Why human implementation—not strategy—is often the hardest part of growth Resources: Connect with Janylène Website: https://hypnocoach.ca/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/janylene/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/hypnocoach_janylene_aka_jt/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/janylene.turcotte.2025 Janylène offers a complimentary 30-minute call through her website and publishes a weekly newsletter with reflections and client stories. Connect with Debra LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Growth Vanguard: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ Free Resource — 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking: https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ Human Sales Playbook: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook Hexagon Media: https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform so you never miss an episode. 💬 Join the conversation by connecting with Debra on LinkedIn and sharing what resonated with you. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover Deals with Heels and the conversations that can help them grow. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

September 15, 2026Episode 13439 min

When Fear, Logic, and Intuition Disagree: How Do You Know What to Trust - with Stephanie Peirolo

Summary We make decisions with more than logic. Our experiences, fears, conditioning, bodies, expectations—and sometimes something we can only describe as intuition—are all giving us information. But what happens when those signals disagree? When logic says go but something inside you says stop, is that resistance fear you need to move through—or information you need to pay attention to? In this episode of Deals with Heels, Debra Bowers talks with board-certified executive coach and author Stephanie Peirolo about discernment, self-trust, resistance, grief, leadership, and the different ways we learn to make consequential decisions. They explore why many high achievers become exceptionally good at pushing through discomfort, but not necessarily at recognizing when discomfort deserves their attention. Stephanie explains why discernment is a practice we can develop before the difficult decision arrives—and why understanding our own decision-making style matters in leadership, relationships, and even sales. The conversation also explores the stories we mistake for facts, how grief affects our ability to make decisions, why leaders need to accept influence, and how learning to trust ourselves can change the way we navigate uncertainty. Key Topics & Main Ideas - Logic, intuition and somatic wisdom in decision-making - Why we may learn to distrust our own internal signals - How conditioning shapes what we believe we're allowed to trust - Building a discernment practice before the difficult decision arrives - The difference between emotional reactivity and intuition - Why self-trust increases our capacity to navigate uncertainty - The stories and inherited narratives we mistake for facts - How grief affects decision-making - Why grief doesn't follow a prescribed timeline - Knowing when resistance deserves curiosity instead of force - Why high achievers may be especially likely to override resistance - Accepting influence as a leadership skill - Why leaders need information from the people closest to the problem - Understanding your personal decision-making style - How decision-making styles become buying behaviors - Why resistance to organizational change may actually be fear about personal capacity - Why different leadership styles are valid - How to make a decision when you don't have unlimited time - Movement, meditation, creativity and community as tools for discernment - Why fear of making the wrong decision can become paralyzing Resources Stephanie Peirolo Author of The Saint and the Drunk: A Guide to Making the Big Decisions in Your Life Website: https://speirolo.com Substack: Fierce Grace Stephanie is also active on Instagram and TikTok under @SPeirolo. Connect with Debra Bowers LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Growth Vanguard: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ Human Sales Playbook: https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook Hexagon Media: https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform so you never miss an episode. 💬 Join the conversation by connecting with Debra on LinkedIn and sharing what resonated with you. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover Deals with Heels and the conversations that can help them grow. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

September 8, 2026Episode 13348 min

Someone needs what you know. Will you risk saying it? with Wiebke Tasch

Most people don't struggle because they have nothing to say. They struggle because they're not yet convinced anyone needs to hear it. We wait until we feel more experienced, more qualified, more confident, or more certain. But what if confidence doesn't have to come before contribution? What if confidence grows because we choose to contribute? In this episode of Deals with Heels , Debra Bowers sits down with Wiebke Tasch , founder and CEO of Digital Authors, to explore what happens when we finally begin trusting our own voice—and allow other people to benefit from what we've learned. Wiebke shares how writing her first book began not with confidence or a publishing strategy, but with a personal need to put her experiences into words. That book eventually became a bestseller and helped launch the publishing career she has today. Debra and Wiebke also explore why capable people—particularly women—can struggle to claim their expertise, how years of expectations and people-pleasing can teach us to water ourselves down, and why sharing what we know can change us as much as the people who receive it. Because sometimes the experience you dismiss as “just my life” contains exactly the insight someone else needs. And sometimes confidence doesn't arrive before we speak. It develops because we finally do. Key Topics - Why capable people struggle to stand behind what they know - Trusting your own voice before you feel completely confident - Why our lived experience can feel ordinary to us - The fear of being judged, misunderstood, or disliked - How people-pleasing can cause us to water down our ideas - Women, authority, and permission to claim expertise - Separating other people's reactions from our responsibility - Why sharing our ideas changes us - Writing as a way to process and understand experience - How articulating your ideas reveals connections between them - Why confidence can follow contribution instead of preceding it - Recognizing the value of your own story - Turning lived experience into something that helps others - Why one meaningful impact can matter more than thousands of passive views - Writing a book as a transformative process for the author - Using your story to create frameworks that help other people - Listening when an idea continues calling you forward - Why market research should happen before writing and positioning a book - Matching expertise with existing market demand Resources Connect with Wiebke Tasch Wiebke shares resources for prospective authors through her website, including a free course based on the Hero's Journey and a market-analysis resource for people considering a book. She is also active on LinkedIn and invites listeners to connect with her there. Website https://www.digital-authors.com LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/wiebke-tasch-%F0%9F%93%9A-43731b164/?locale=en Connect with Debra Bowers LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Human Sales Playbook https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook The Growth Vanguard https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ Hexagon Media https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels Deals with Heels explores the human side of leadership, growth, sales, decision-making, and the moments that shape who we become as leaders. If this conversation made you think of someone who has something valuable to say but hasn't quite trusted themselves enough to say it yet, share this episode with them. 🎧 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform so you never miss an episode. 💬 Join the conversation by connecting with Debra on LinkedIn and sharing what resonated with you. ⭐ Leave a rating or review to help more people discover Deals with Heels and the conversations that can help them grow. Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

September 1, 2026Episode 13237 min

When Everyone Resists Your Idea: Leadership, Trust, and the Courage to Listen with Tina Larsson

Description Every leader eventually reaches a moment when they can see what needs to change. The harder part is helping everyone else see it too. Organizations, teams, and communities rarely resist change simply because the idea is bad. Change asks people to give up something familiar, accept uncertainty, learn something new, invest time and energy—and trust that they can handle whatever happens next. In this episode of Deals with Heels , Debra Bowers sits down with Tina Larsson , co-founder of The Folson Group, to explore leadership, governance, resistance to change, and what HOA and co-op boards can teach us about leading people through difficult decisions. Drawing from Tina's experience advising condominium and co-op boards—and her own experience helping transform her building's board—Debra and Tina discuss why volunteer boards can become reactive, how competing priorities derail long-term planning, why the loudest complainer may still have something important to say, and why outside perspective can sometimes break through problems insiders have been raising for years. They also explore an uncomfortable leadership question: What if people aren't resisting your idea because they're afraid of change? What if they're resisting because your idea isn't actually the best one? Because leading change requires more than conviction. It requires trust, listening, discernment, communication, and enough confidence to reconsider your own thinking when the evidence tells you to. Key Topics - Why people resist necessary change - Fear of change versus fear of our capacity to handle change - Why familiarity can feel easier than intentional change - How HOA and co-op boards make complex decisions - The challenges of volunteer leadership - Why organizations become trapped in reactive problem-solving - Proactive versus reactive leadership - Building trust before asking people to follow - Listening as a leadership skill - How leaders build demand for change - Why credibility and consistency matter - The value of outside perspective - When complainers stop being heard - How emotional history creates listening blind spots - Using data to build support for change - How to tell whether resistance is fear—or your idea is wrong - Separating personal investment from good decision-making - Prioritizing infrastructure over appearances - Creating long-term plans that survive leadership turnover - Starting with the end in mind Resources Connect with Tina Larsson The Folson Group https://thefolsongroup.com/ Living the High Life Tina Larsson's book about helping co-op and condominium boards move from reactive management toward proactive governance. The first chapter and additional free resources are available through The Folson Group website. Connect with Debra Bowers LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ The Human Sales Playbook https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook The Growth Vanguard https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ Hexagon Media https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels If this conversation resonated with you, share it with a leader, founder, board member, or colleague who needs to hear it. Deals with Heels is where we explore the human side of leadership, growth, sales, decision-making, and the moments that shape who we become as leaders. Follow the show so you never miss an episode, and if you're enjoying these conversations, please leave a review. Your reviews help more listeners discover the show and support our ability to bring thoughtful, meaningful conversations to a wider audience. 🎙 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform ⭐ Leave a review and help us grow 📢 Share this episode with someone who could benefit from the conversation Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable .

August 25, 2026Episode 13143 min

When Betrayal Changes How You Trust Yourself with Dr. Debi Silber

Description When someone betrays our trust, we expect it to change how we see them. What we may not expect is how deeply it can change the way we see ourselves . If I trusted someone and I was wrong, can I trust my own judgment? My intuition? My decisions? And what happens when those questions quietly follow us into our leadership, relationships, work, and willingness to connect with other people? In this episode of Deals with Heels , Debra Bowers sits down with Dr. Debi Silber , founder of the Post-Betrayal Transformation Institute and researcher behind one of the largest studies on betrayal, to explore why betrayal is different from other forms of trauma and what can happen when it remains unresolved. Debi explains how betrayal can shatter not only a relationship, but our internal system for deciding who and what is safe. Together, Debra and Debi explore functional freeze, repeated patterns, vulnerability, emotional avoidance, self-trust, and why highly capable people can appear successful while still carrying unresolved experiences beneath the surface. They also challenge a quality leaders are often praised for: resilience. Because sometimes working harder, staying strong, exercising more, pushing through, and continuing to perform aren't signs that we've healed. Sometimes they're very effective ways of avoiding what still needs our attention. And perhaps moving forward isn't about becoming who we were before. Perhaps the opportunity is to rebuild something different. Key Topics - Betrayal as the breaking of spoken or unspoken trust - Why betrayal can affect self-trust and discernment - Post-Betrayal Syndrome - Why unresolved betrayal can repeat through different relationships - Functional freeze and the appearance of functioning well - How betrayal affects leadership and decision-making - Why high performers can hide emotional avoidance inside achievement - The difference between resilience and transformation - When hard work becomes a form of numbing or distraction - Why “fine” can become a place where people get stuck - Familiarity versus safety - Rebuilding identity after betrayal - Trust accumulation and Compound Confidence - How past betrayal can influence present relationships and buying behavior - The Five Stages of Betrayal Recovery - Moving beyond recovery toward transformation Resources Connect with Dr. Debi Silber The Post Betrayal Transformation Institute https://thepbtinstitute.com/ Trust Again Dr. Debi Silber's book for those navigating betrayal and rebuilding trust. Unstuck Dr. Debi Silber's resource for coaches, counselors, therapists, and practitioners seeking to better understand the Five Stages of Betrayal Recovery. Books are available through Amazon and linked through the PBT Institute website. Connect with Debra Bowers LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Human Sales Playbook https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ The Growth Vanguard https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ Hexagon Media https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels If this conversation resonated with you, share it with a leader, founder, or colleague who needs to hear it. Deals with Heels is where we explore the human side of leadership, growth, sales, decision-making, and the moments that shape who we become as leaders. Follow the show so you never miss an episode, and if you're enjoying these conversations, please leave a review. Your reviews help more listeners discover the show and support our ability to bring thoughtful, meaningful conversations to a wider audience. 🎙 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform ⭐ Leave a review and help us grow 📢 Share this episode with someone who could benefit from the conversation Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.

August 18, 2026Episode 13040 min

When Survival Becomes a Superpower: Turning Adversity Into Leadership Strength with Allie Grack

Description Some of the skills that make people exceptional leaders aren't learned in classrooms, boardrooms, or leadership programs. They're learned much earlier. Through adversity. Adaptation. Reading the room. Solving problems quickly. Navigating uncertainty. Learning how to keep going when no one is coming to rescue you. But the same survival strategies that once protected us can eventually become the patterns that hold us back. In this episode of Deals with Heels , Debra Bowers sits down with entrepreneur and Workhorse Marketing founder Allie Grack for a candid conversation about childhood adversity, resilience, creativity, self-trust, leadership, and learning to work with the mind and experiences you've been given rather than constantly fighting against them. Allie shares how adoption, foster care, becoming a teen mother, and growing up without consistent stability shaped her fierce independence and belief that there is always another step forward. She also explores what she's had to learn as a leader: understanding her own weaknesses, developing emotional intelligence, creating a workplace where people can thrive, and recognizing that success doesn't have to mean sacrificing everything else. Together, Debra and Allie explore a deeper question: How do we know when we're responding to today's reality with wisdom—and when we're still reacting from the survival patterns that got us here? Because growth isn't about erasing where we've been. It's about understanding what our experiences taught us, deciding what still serves us, and learning to trust ourselves enough to write what comes next. Key Topics - Childhood adversity and leadership - How survival strategies become leadership strengths - Hyper-independence and self-trust - Processing experience instead of avoiding it - Compound Confidence and accumulated evidence - Creativity and the “messy mind” - Pattern recognition as a leadership strength - Knowing what you know—and what you don't - Emotional intelligence and communication - Creating psychologically safer workplaces - Modeling the culture you say you value - Redefining success beyond money - Separating your identity from other people's judgments - Choosing what your story means Resources Connect with Allie Grack Workhorse Marketing https://teamworkhorse.com/ LinkedIn — Allie Grack Workhorse Marketing is a women-founded, women-run marketing agency working with “good people doing good things.” Connect with Debra Bowers LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-bowers/ The Human Sales Playbook https://thegrowthvanguard.com/free-ebook 5 Signs Your Growth Is Breaking https://5signs.thegrowthvanguard.com/ The Growth Vanguard https://thegrowthvanguard.com/ Hexagon Media https://hexagonmedia.net/ Stay Connected with Deals with Heels If this conversation resonated with you, share it with a leader, founder, or colleague who needs to hear it. Deals with Heels is where we explore the human side of leadership, growth, sales, decision-making, and the moments that shape who we become as leaders. Follow the show so you never miss an episode, and if you're enjoying these conversations, please leave a review. Your reviews help more listeners discover the show and support our ability to bring thoughtful, meaningful conversations to a wider audience. 🎙 Follow Deals with Heels on your favorite podcast platform ⭐ Leave a review and help us grow 📢 Share this episode with someone who could benefit from the conversation Until next time, stand strong in your power—especially when it gets uncomfortable.