Carrot and Stick

Hosted by OneUp Sales

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Apr 2026

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About the show

Welcome to the Carrot and Stick Podcast, a podcast series where we try to get under the skin of all things sales, management and motivation. Speaking to sales leaders, down to individual salespeople, and everything in between to really understand what makes the wonderful world of sales tick.

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42 recent

April 2, 2026Episode 359 min

The Death of the Generalist Recruiter | Chris Atiyah, CEO of Engtal

Recruitment has always rewarded specialists — but how do you stay niche when you're scaling across multiple markets? On this episode of Carrot & Stick, host Derry Holt sits down with Chris Atiyah, CEO and Co-founder of Engtal — a Chicago-based firm that has scaled to 50 people across three specialist brands with zero attrition in over eight months. Chris shares his journey from Portsmouth to the Midwest and how a relentless focus on the right people, the right markets, and the right technology has built one of recruitment's most quietly impressive businesses.If you want to know what a successful, AI-enabled recruitment business looks like in practice, this episode is for you.

February 5, 2026Episode 21 hr 20 min

Sam Crisp from Axonas Consulting | From Agency Founder to Exit

How do you build a recruitment agency that not only scales but survives the founder’s eventual exit? On this episode of Carrot & Stick, host Derry Holt dives deep with Sam Crisp, the former founder of the highly successful SaaS recruitment agency, Arama. Sam shares his explosive journey of growing a business to 60 people and then making the strategic decision to step away. The discussion tackles the critical mistakes in early-stage scaling, the hidden dangers of the 'shiny client' syndrome, and why process, systems, and data integrity are the true architecture of long-term success.Discover the framework Sam now uses at his new consultancy, Axonas, to optimize internal talent teams—lessons learned directly from a decade on the front line.

November 26, 2025Episode 11 hr 3 min

Martin Doig and Robbie Sturgess from Verto People - Why Cold Calling Is Essential For Perm Growth

Martin Doig and Robbie Sturgess, founders of Verto People, join Derry Holt to explain how their 99% perm agency not only survived a pandemic launch but rapidly scaled to 38 employees by prioritizing relentless daily Business Development (BD) over fleeting contract trends.They share their controversial stance on cold calling, detail their data-driven hiring methodology, and unpack the crucial lessons learned from scaling too fast into unfamiliar markets like Germany.Key Takeaways:- "Cold Calling is alive": The controversial view that BD must be done every day, non-negotiable.- The Data-Driven Hire: Using psychometrics to vet recruiters for sales aptitude, resulting in an 80%+ success rate.- Scaling Lessons: Why they intentionally pulled out of the German market and software niches to focus resources entirely on explosive US engineering growth.- The 8-Touch Rule: How Verto ensures success by following a highly targeted, multi-touch BD process for every single candidate.

June 18, 20251 hr 0 min

Saeed Bhor: Why Process is > Tech, Data Audits & Navigating Rectech

Derry Holt talks with recruitment ops expert Saeed Bhor about the common operational mistakes agencies make. They cover the crucial difference between performance and recruitment data, why "process over tech" is his mantra, how to navigate the crowded Rectech market, and what to look for in a consultant. An episode packed with practical advice for improving agency efficiency.

June 4, 202557 min

Laura Clark: Buying Out Her Mum, Performance Truths & OA's Culture

Derry Holt chats with Laura Clark, owner of OA Recruitment Solutions. Laura shares her journey from a Yellow Pages start to buying out her mother's £20M turnover business. They dive into OA's unique "Back on Track" performance plans, her "magnet" hiring philosophy, the importance of L&D, and her take on remote work. A truly insightful episode on leadership and culture.

May 21, 2025Episode 1053 min

Elliot Dell: Salt's Global M&A Strategy, Founder Branding & AI Insights

Derry Holt talks with Elliot Dell, CEO of Salt Recruitment Group, about their unique global M&A expansion model, the power of authentic founder-led branding, his journey into coaching, and a practical take on AI in recruitment. An inspiring episode on building a global business with heart and vision.

May 7, 2025Episode 958 min

Why Dubai? David Morel Talks Global Expansion, AI & Leadership Lessons | Carrot & Stick Podcast

Derry Holt talks with David Morel, founder of the global recruitment firm Tiger Recruitment. David shares 20+ years of insights on scaling internationally (including his recent move to Dubai), leading by example, using data effectively, the real role of AI in recruitment, and maintaining a strong culture. Essential listening for agency leaders on longevity and growth.

April 23, 2025Episode 859 min

Sachin Ruparelia: Scaling Camino Partners, Key Metrics & Personal Growth

Derry Holt talks with Sachin Ruparelia, CEO of Camino Partners, about scaling a recruitment business in tough times, the metrics that really count, and fostering a high-performance culture. Sachin also shares his inspiring personal journey of transformation, therapy, and finding his 'why' in family and positive impact. Essential listening on leadership, resilience, and motivation.

April 9, 2025Episode 757 min

From £25M Turnover to Rock Bottom: Chris O'Connell on Surviving PE & Finding Real Leadership

This week, Derry Holt talks to Chris O'Connell about his incredible journey building a £25M recruitment business, navigating a traumatic Private Equity (PE) exit, and finding strength in vulnerability. They dive deep into authentic leadership (why being 'real' works), the pitfalls of over-automating BD, and Chris's love-hate relationship with LinkedIn. A raw, honest conversation packed with lessons for anyone in recruitment.

March 26, 2025Episode 652 min

Is Training Overrated? Ben Browning on Building a Winning Recruitment Sales Process | Carrot & Stick Podcast

Is recruitment training overrated? Ben Browning (Resonant, Recruiting Better Podcast) argues process is king. He joins Derry Holt to share insights from surveying 500+ agencies on BD, moving beyond transactional sales, crafting a sales story, and reframing rejection.#recruitment #salesprocess #BD #salestraining #consultativeselling #podcast