Scale Room with Olya Grovel

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Oct 2026

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What if you could sit in on a high-stakes scaling consultation — for free? Every week on The Scale Room, a product founder brings a live challenge to Olya Grovel (ex-PayPal, angel investor, SLS Labs founder) & they work through it together on the mic. No preparation. No hindsight polish. You hear the real-time diagnosis: what's actually broken, what to fix first, and why the obvious answer is usually wrong. It's pattern recognition you can steal, decision-making you can study, and the closest thing to having a Scale SWAT operator in your corner. For founders scaling past their first million $.

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October 24, 2026Episode 5021 min

[S4] #50 When Do You Walk Away From The SaaS You Built? with Jose "Caya" Cayasso

The Scale Room | Episode [50] — Caya, Co-Founder & CEO at Slidebean What happens when a SaaS company runs out of money, can't raise its next round and has to rethink what business it's actually in? In this episode of The Scale Room , recorded live at Infobip Shift in Croatia, Olya Grovel sits down with Caya, Co-Founder & CEO at Slidebean , to talk about the company's journey from SaaS startup to media business. After reaching around $1.5M in ARR and getting stuck between seed and Series A, Slidebean had to choose between continuing to raise or cutting costs and becoming profitable. That decision ultimately opened the door to a new growth engine: YouTube . Caya shares how YouTube became a major part of Slidebean's business, why the company now operates different channels for different audiences and what it means to let go of a product after more than a decade of building it. They also discuss AI, the changing SaaS landscape, product-market fit, founder resilience and knowing when it's time to move on. In this episode, we explore: From SaaS to a media business Running out of runway and choosing profitability How YouTube became a growth engine Building and monetizing an audience Why SaaS is becoming harder to defend AI and the future of software Knowing when to let go of a product Separating the founder from the company Why infrastructure may be the next big opportunity ⏱️ TIMESTAMPS 00:00 — Cold Open & Highlights 00:27 — Meet Caya & Slidebean 00:48 — How Slidebean Discovered YouTube 01:38 — From SaaS Startup to Media Business 02:00 — Getting Stuck Between Seed & Series A 02:45 — The $1.5M ARR Problem 03:00 — Running Out of Money & Choosing Profitability 03:34 — What Happened After Slidebean Became Profitable? 03:38 — The First YouTube Sponsorship 04:30 — Building Slidebean's Media Business 05:25 — What's Driving Revenue Today? 06:22 — When Your SaaS Product Becomes a Commodity 06:57 — Should Founders Keep Fighting or Move On? 08:10 — The Pitch Story & The Presentation Market 09:38 — Slidebean's Biggest Challenge Today 09:48 — AI & The Changing SaaS Landscape 10:30 — Why Engineering Isn't the Same Moat Anymore 11:22 — Can Presentation Software Survive? 12:09 — Retention & The Problem With Presentations 12:45 — Will Slidebean's Product Still Exist in 3–5 Years? 12:58 — Why Caya Wouldn't Start a SaaS Company Today 14:42 — Decoupling the Founder From the Product 15:00 — When Is It Time to Give Up? 16:00 — Exhausting Every Option 17:29 — How Many Products Can a Founder Build? 18:02 — The Reality of Being a Founder 18:47 — Turning YouTube Into a Growth Engine 19:04 — From Founder Content to Business Content 19:40 — Company Forensics & The YouTube Strategy 20:50 — Why Slidebean Created a Second Channel 21:55 — Behind the Scenes & Closing A candid conversation about SaaS, YouTube, AI, profitability and the realities of building a company that doesn't always end up looking like the one you started. Follow The Scale Room for more conversations with founders, investors, operators and leaders building what's next. #TheScaleRoom #JoseCayasso #Episode50 #Caya #Slidebean #SaaS #Startups #Entrepreneurship #YouTube #StartupFunding #VentureCapital #AI #FounderAdvice #InfobipShift #ContentMarketing

October 14, 2026Episode 4923 min

[S4] #49 Profitable And Done Raising. What Does Your VC Do Now? with Vuk Lau

The Scale Room | Episode 49 — Vuk Lau, Partner at Silicon Gardens What happens when a startup becomes profitable and decides it doesn't need to raise another round? In Episode 49 of The Scale Room , recorded live at Infobip Shift in Croatia, Olya Grovel sat down with Vuk Lau, Partner at Silicon Gardens , a Slovenia-based, founders-for-founders venture fund investing in founders from the region with global ambitions. Vuk shares his perspective on the changing venture capital landscape, from profitable startups choosing sustainable growth over repeated fundraising to the challenges facing European VC funds in generating meaningful returns. He explains why some companies may no longer need multiple funding rounds, how investment mandates can influence valuations and why achieving a real exit is taking longer than ever. They discuss the growing gap between paper valuations and actual liquidity, the risks of overfunding startups, and what happens when a portfolio company becomes profitable but no longer wants to raise additional capital. Vuk also shares what Silicon Gardens looks for in founders, why big vision matters, how customer validation can separate promising ideas from assumptions and why a little delusion might be necessary to build something ambitious. In this episode, we explore: Why profitable startups may not need another funding round The challenges facing European venture capital and fund returns How government-backed funds and investment mandates influence startup valuations Why the road to liquidity is getting longer The difference between paper valuations and real returns What happens when founders choose profitability over fundraising Why investor value goes beyond providing capital The importance of founder vision, ambition and customer validation Why Silicon Gardens is looking to grow its next fund Finding a technical co-founder after validating a business idea How founders can approach venture capital investors Why relationships and trust remain essential in early-stage investing ⏱️ TIMESTAMPS 00:00 — Cold Open & Highlights 01:15 — Show Intro & Title Sequence 02:00 — Welcome & Speaker-1 Introduction 02:45 — Introduction to Vuk Lau & Silicon Gardens 03:45 — Profitable Startups & Avoiding Dilution 05:00 — Managing LP Expectations & Reporting Metrics 06:30 — Fund Structure & Investment Cycles 07:20 — European VC Returns & The DPI Challenge 08:50 — Visual Insert: European vs. US VC Performance 09:40 — Government-Backed Funds & Regional Overfunding 11:30 — Zombie Funds & Slow Capital Deployment 12:35 — Extending Timelines to Liquidity Events 14:00 — Rethinking Fund Structures & Revenue Models 15:30 — Value-Add Beyond Capital & Diaspora Talent 17:00 — Founder Green Flags: Vision & Market Validation 18:30 — Ambition vs. Delusion in European Founders 19:40 — Scaling Up: Silicon Gardens' Next Fund 20:50 — What Happens When Profitable Startups Stop Raising? 21:50 — Investing in Non-Technical Founders 22:20 — How to Pitch Silicon Gardens 22:45 — Outro & Closing Credits A candid conversation about venture capital, startup funding, profitability and what it really takes to build valuable companies in an evolving startup ecosystem. Follow The Scale Room for more conversations with founders, investors, operators and leaders building what's next. #TheScaleRoom #VukLau #SiliconGardens #Episode49 #VentureCapital #StartupFunding #Startups #Entrepreneurship #EuropeanStartups #FounderAdvice #InfobipShift

October 5, 2026Episode 4819 min

[S4] #48 The Feature You Love Isn't the One They'll Buy with Liina Laas

The Scale Room | Episode 48 — Liina Laas, Co-Founder & CEO of Knowzilla What does it really take to build an AI sales company from the ground up? In Episode 48 of The Scale Room , Olya Grovel sat down with Liina Laas, Co-Founder & CEO of Knowzilla , to talk about building a startup in one of the most crowded categories in SaaS — AI sales. Liina shares the story behind Knowzilla, from identifying a real problem in sales teams to turning an early idea into a product, speaking with customers, signing the first pilots and building momentum in an increasingly competitive AI market. They discuss what sales teams actually need from AI, why real-time guidance can change the way reps handle live conversations and how founders can build products around genuine customer pain rather than chasing trends. Liina also opens up about the realities of being an early-stage founder, moving quickly, finding the right people, validating an idea, fundraising and figuring things out while building the company at the same time. In this episode, we explore: Building Knowzilla from idea to first pilots Entering the crowded AI sales and SaaS market Why sales teams still struggle with knowledge and confidence How AI can support reps during live sales conversations Customer discovery and building around real problems The challenges of scaling an early-stage startup Fundraising and finding the right investors Hiring and building a strong founding team What founders can learn from years of sales experience Why the future of sales isn't simply about replacing humans with AI A candid conversation about AI, sales, entrepreneurship and what it takes to build something new when the market is already crowded. Follow The Scale Room for more conversations with founders, operators and leaders building what's next. #TheScaleRoom #LiinaLaas #Knowzilla #AI #SalesAI #SaaS #Startup #Entrepreneurship #B2BSales #ArtificialIntelligence #Founders #SalesEnablement

July 10, 2026Episode 4737 min

[S4] #47 Closing 1 in 3 Calls — and Still Starving at Top of Funnel with Bailey Darling

Bailey Darling built GIA to be the ultimate Go-To-Market co-pilot for consultancies and boutique agencies, boasting an incredible 1-in-3 closing rate once an ideal prospect gets on a sales call. The conversion strategy works. So why does Olya tell him his top-of-funnel is hitting a ceiling? In this live Scale Room session , she breaks down why trying to sell a complex, multi-feature platform upfront destroys your cold outbound response rates—and why you need to lead with a single, high-impact "wedge" feature instead. From there, the discussion dives into the unique buying psychology of B2B service firms. How do agencies actually shop for tools compared to traditional tech startups? How do you turn unpredictable word-of-mouth wins into an automated, trigger-based referral engine? How do you transition a tool from a solo founder's workflow to a scalable team account expansion? This episode explores agency growth mechanics, B2B marketing channel realities, experiment hygiene and overcoming the common founder habit of over-delivering for free. Key Takeaways: Leading with a high-value "wedge" feature vs. positioning an all-in-one platform play The trust-based buying psychology of agency owners and boutique consultancies Ditching high-churn solopreneurs to focus on sticky 2–25 person target accounts Engineering trigger-based referral programs around customer "wow moments" Video channel calibration: Why B2B leaders consume comedy on TikTok but education on LinkedIn Overcoming imposter syndrome and the founder trap of giving away upsells for free Tactical expansion frameworks to seamlessly upsell seats to client account managers Experiment hygiene: Setting rigid "kill cliffs" to protect your cash runway from bleeding out Timestamps: 00:00 Intro & GIA's 1-in-3 Closing Rate 00:49 Understanding GIA & The Agency Growth Ceiling 02:13 The Core Value: Turning Client Calls Into LinkedIn IP 04:40 Challenging the ICP: Founders vs. Professional Service Firms 06:58 Defining the Sweet Spot & Trimming Churn Potential 09:12 High-Touch Customer Discovery & Onboarding Tactics 11:05 The Positioning Mistake: Avoiding the "Chinese Buffet" Approach 13:32 Auditing Acquisition Channels: Outbound vs. Invisible Word-of-Mouth 15:05 Systematizing Referrals Post-User "Wow Moments" 16:30 Co-Marketing, Watermarks, and Credibility Distribution 19:27 TikTok & Instagram Realities for B2B Audiences 21:49 Balancing Immediate MRR Needs with Long-Term Growth Engines 24:22 Getting Closer to Your Customer's Wallet 27:16 The Free Feature Trap: Overcoming Founder Coaching Blindspots 30:53 Seat Expansion Mechanics for In-House Teams 33:02 Experiment Hygiene: Implementing Hard Timelines & Kill Cliffs 34:36 Advice to My Younger Self: Relentless Work & Controlling the Controllables 36:17 Closing Thoughts & Where to Find GIA Live If this episode challenged the way you think about growth, share it with another founder, operator or investor who needs to hear it. Follow Scale Room with Olya Grovel for weekly live sessions where founders bring their biggest business challenges to the table and leave with actionable strategies they can implement immediately. ⭐ If you enjoyed this conversation, leave a rating and review on Spotify. It helps more ambitious founders discover the show and allows us to keep bringing on world-class guests. See you in the next episode.

June 27, 2026Episode 4643 min

[S4] #46 The Influencer Growth Trap: Why Your Best Channel Dies in 12 Months with Adrian Søbyskogen

Adrian runs Akka , a platform opening access to private market investing through influencer-led distribution. The strategy works. So why does Olya tell him it's a trap? In this live Scale Room session, she breaks down why creator marketing isn't a sustainable acquisition channel—it's a launch event with a built-in lifespan. From there, the discussion dives into one of the hardest problems in European expansion: trust. Who actually influences financial decisions in each country? Why do GTM strategies fail when copied across borders? How do you build growth systems that last after the influencer momentum fades? This episode explores international expansion, fintech distribution, trust dynamics and building scalable acquisition channels beyond social media. Key Takeaways Why influencer-led growth eventually plateaus The 9–12 month lifecycle of creator acquisition channels Attention vs trust in customer acquisition Country-specific GTM strategies across Europe Identifying local market champions Sustainable growth beyond influencers Scaling fintech through trust instead of reach Founder lessons on category creation Timestamps 00:00 Intro & Akka's Growth Strategy 02:12 Building Through Influencers 05:08 Why It Worked 08:14 Challenging the Model 11:05 The Influencer Expiration Problem 14:18 Attention vs Trust 17:42 Scaling GTM Across Countries 21:03 Local Trust Systems Explained 24:26 France vs Nordic Markets 27:31 Finding Market Champions 30:18 Sustainable Distribution Systems 33:06 Beyond Influencer Marketing 36:01 Long-Term Growth Frameworks 39:12 Future of Retail Investing 41:18 Founder Lessons 42:15 Closing Thoughts If this episode challenged the way you think about growth, share it with another founder, operator or investor who needs to hear it. Follow Scale Room with Olya Grovel for weekly live sessions where founders bring their biggest business challenges to the table and leave with actionable strategies they can implement immediately. ⭐ If you enjoyed this conversation, leave a rating and review on Spotify. It helps more ambitious founders discover the show and allows us to keep bringing on world-class guests. See you in the next episode.

June 18, 2026Episode 4539 min

[S4] #45 He Built a €0-Marketing Brand. The Problem Is Getting People to Return with Hector Hughes

Hector Hughes thought he was building his dream career. Instead, he found himself overwhelmed, disconnected, and increasingly dissatisfied with the life he had created. Everything changed after a 10-day silent retreat in the Himalayas where his phone was taken away and he spent ten days alone with his thoughts. One week later, he quit his job. Soon after, he launched Unplugged, a startup helping people disconnect from technology through off-grid cabins designed specifically for digital detox experiences. In this episode, Hector joins Olya Grovel to explore: • Why modern life is making us more distracted, anxious, and burned out • The founder mindset traps that drive overwork and unhappiness • How dopamine addiction impacts performance and decision-making • Why Unplugged grew rapidly during and after COVID • The surprising reason couples became their strongest customer segment • How to build a company around long-term impact rather than short-term exits • What it really takes to create a movement instead of just another product This conversation is part startup strategy, part psychology deep dive, and part wake-up call for anyone feeling trapped in the always-on culture. Timestamps 00:00 Hector Hughes' Origin Story 01:02 The Silent Retreat That Changed His Life 01:50 Quitting His Job to Start Unplugged 02:07 Launching a Startup Right Before COVID 03:10 Why COVID Became a Massive Tailwind 04:05 The Influencer Post That Changed Everything 05:00 Who Uses Unplugged Today? 06:15 Expanding Into Spain Without Losing Focus 08:05 Why Most Startups Think Too Short-Term 09:15 Building a Company for 30 Years, Not 5 10:20 The Dark Side of Founder Ambition 12:00 Why Entrepreneurs Struggle to Feel "Enough" 13:45 Overperformance, Burnout & Hustle Culture 15:10 Creating Demand for Digital Detox 16:35 Why Most People Can't Put Their Phones Down 17:20 The Psychology Behind Unplugged's Experience 18:40 How Guests Actually Disconnect for 3 Days 20:00 Turning Unplugged Into a Habit 21:10 Why Couples Became Their Biggest Customer Segment 22:20 Burnout, Executives & Corporate Retreats 23:20 The Hidden Cost of Constant Connectivity 24:30 Dopamine Addiction Explained 26:00 Why Unplugged Requires a Minimum 3-Day Stay 26:50 Hector's Biggest Growth Challenge Today 27:30 How to Increase Customer Retention 29:00 Nervous System Regulation & Mental Fitness 30:30 Creating a Movement Around Unplugging 32:00 Building the "Nike of Digital Wellbeing" 33:20 The Future Vision for Unplugged 35:00 Simplicity vs Overengineering the Experience 36:00 Hector's Most Important Lesson 36:40 "Nobody Cares As Much As You Think" 37:10 Final Thoughts & Where to Find Hector If this episode resonated with you, follow Scale Room on Spotify and share it with someone who needs a reminder to unplug.

April 28, 2026Episode 4441 min

[S4] #44 Your SaaS Is Shrinking and You're Avoiding the Money with Foti Panagiotakopoulos

The Scale Room Ep. 2 — Foti Panagiotakopoulos on AI, Mentorship, Burnout & Building Human-Centered Companies In this deeply personal and unexpectedly emotional episode of The Scale Room , Olya sits down with Foti Panagiotakopoulos, founder of GrowthMentor for a raw conversation about entrepreneurship, AI disruption, mentorship, founder psychology, burnout, and the human need for connection. What starts as a story about postpartum depression, isolation, and one life-changing mentorship call evolves into a wide-ranging exploration of what scaling actually feels like in 2026. Foti opens up about: Why GrowthMentor is shrinking in the AI era What AI can never replace Founder loneliness and “sanity-check” conversations The emotional side of decision-making Why most entrepreneurs are solving the wrong problems His struggle with enterprise sales and self-worth Building side quests like ParentMentor & Growth Adventures Burnout, ambition, and redefining success This episode is part founder therapy, part strategy session, and part existential reflection on what it means to build companies in a world where AI can do almost everything except be human. If you’ve ever questioned your direction, your ambition, or yourself… this one will hit hard.

March 27, 2026Episode 4350 min

[S4] #43 Your Competitors Own ChatGPT Search. Now What? with Frank Sondors

Frank Sondors scaled Salesforge to €3M ARR in year one and now he's making a bet most founders haven't even considered: generative engine optimization. He comes to The Scale Room with a question that's about to matter for every B2B company — how do you win when your buyers stop Googling and start asking ChatGPT instead? Olya digs into his GEO playbook, his Wikipedia hack, why mentions are the new backlinks, and the channel-kill decisions that got him here. If you're still treating SEO as your only organic strategy, this one's going to sting.

January 30, 2026Episode 4258 min

[S3] #42 Micro-Decisions That Shape Your Life: Mindset, Money & Leadership - with Maria Reid

Most decisions that change our lives don’t look dramatic from the outside. They happen quietly in our thoughts, our beliefs, and the stories we tell ourselves. In this episode of Decision Factory , Maria shares the most pivotal decision she ever made and it had nothing to do with her career, business, or external success. It was the moment she chose to change her perspective. We talk about: Feeling like life is “happening to you” instead of for you The identity crisis that often follows motherhood and major life transitions Why money decisions are emotional, not logical How women unconsciously play it safe with pricing and ambition The power of micro-decisions and how they quietly shape your future Why the state you create from determines what you create more of This conversation is for anyone who feels stuck in the messy middle, not who they used to be, not yet who they’re becoming and is ready to stop operating on autopilot. Because the most important decisions aren’t always the loud ones. They’re the ones you make internally, every single day.

January 27, 2026Episode 4148 min

[S3] #41 He Turned Down a $30M Valuation and Built a Profitable Startup Anyway - with Adam Fard

Everyone tells founders the same story: Raise money. Move fast. Figure it out later. Adam Fard chose a different path. In this episode of Decision Factory , Olya Grovel sits down with Adam Fard , founder of UX Pilot , to unpack why he turned down a VC term sheet at a $30M valuation and how bootstrapping gave him something far more valuable than capital: clarity and control . Adam shares how UX Pilot grew from an internal agency tool into a profitable AI product, how he filters real signal from noisy feedback, and why metrics like NPS and usage often matter more than early revenue . They dive into decision-making under uncertainty, avoiding confirmation bias, removing features instead of adding them, and how AI is reshaping UX design without replacing human judgment. This episode is a masterclass in calm, disciplined decision-making for founders who want to build something real, not just something fundable. 🎧 Listen if you’re questioning whether raising money is actually the right move.

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