Business of Apps Podcast

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Episodes

278

Latest episode

Oct 2026

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EN-US

About the show

The Business of Apps podcast brings you actionable insights from the leaders of the global app industry and the world’s fastest growing apps. App marketing professionals, product managers and developers share the latest approaches to building, marketing and monetizing mobile apps. Every Monday we have a candid conversation with app industry professionals about specific topic that may cover app marketing, mobile advertising or app development and we also help our listeners to get to know our guests better.

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60 recent

October 19, 2026Episode 2786 min

278: “How to prove CTV ads drive app installs” with Connor Kernochan, Head of Apps and Games at Vibe

This time we're digging into connected TV as a performance channel for mobile apps - and how to prove it actually drove an install. TV has always been good at building brands. The hard part is showing it led to a conversion. As a top-of-funnel channel, CTV often loses the attribution credit to whatever touched the user last, and that's where incrementality testing comes in. To cover all this, we've got Connor Kernochan, Head of Apps and Games at Vibe, talking to tech journalist David Murphy at Business of Apps New York about measuring CTV campaigns and running them the right way. Connor explains what counts as connected TV, why it's now a performance play as well as a branding play, and how MMP data shows which strategies are working. He also covers how incrementality works in practice, including geo lift tests and ghost bids. If you work in user acquisition, app marketing, or mobile measurement, this is a clear look at how to measure CTV and fit it into your existing media mix. Today’s topics include: What connected TV is - Hulu, Peacock, HBO Max, Roku, and ESPN on the biggest screen in the house Brand and performance - targeting viewers like any other digital channel and measuring well enough to optimize Measuring a CTV campaign - plugging into AppsFlyer, Adjust, or Singular as the source of truth Why CTV loses attribution credit - many touch-points before a conversion, and CTV sits at the top of the funnel Incrementality in practice - comparing exposed and control groups through geo lift tests and ghost bids Doing CTV the right way - direct publisher relationships, and CTV data alongside your other channels Links and Resources: Connor Kernochan on LinkedIn Vibe.co website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Connor Kernochan: The real value is that it is a branding play, but it is also a performance play." "CTV often loses out on attribution credit because of the nature of being a top of funnel channel." "Whatever any of our clients are using as their source of truth for how they look to measure and report on their KPIs is what we plug into." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

October 15, 2026Episode 2775 min

277: “Creative is the new targeting for app growth” with Jonathan Yantz, Managing Partner at M+C Saatchi Performance

Today's topic is where app marketing budgets should go - and why creative now does the work that audience settings used to do. Ad platforms are increasingly machine learning-led, and the industry is increasingly privacy-led. Put the two together, and the creative you run decides who sees your ad. A couple of hero videos won't cut it anymore. To cover all this, we've got Jonathan Yantz, Managing Partner at M+C Saatchi Performance, talking to tech journalist David Murphy at Business of Apps New York about budget allocation, creative strategy, and retention. Jonathan explains why budget planning starts with a robust testing plan, how to be ready for new channels like ChatGPT ads before they arrive, and what a creative strategy built on a large number of variations looks like. He also covers why retention matters more when every dollar is under scrutiny. If you work in app marketing, performance media, or creative strategy, this is a clear look at how to plan, test, and spend when the algorithm does the targeting. Today’s topics include: Budget allocation - a testing plan thought through in advance, especially going into the end of the fiscal year New channels - having a plan ready and making sure you can measure any extra dollar Creative is the new targeting - how machine learning-led platforms and privacy changes moved the job to creative A robust creative strategy - many variations, with the next batch ready to go From A/B to A-to-Z testing - tying creative back to the overall testing strategy Budget scrutiny and retention - acquiring a user is costly, so keeping them is the easiest way to grow Links and Resources: Jonathan Yantz on LinkedIn M+C Saatchi Performance website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Jonathan Yantz: "We always said creative is king. And now we're saying creative is the new targeting, which is absolutely true." "Any extra dollar is going to be the most important one to measure." "Every dollar has to drive something." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

October 12, 2026Episode 2769 min

276: “CTV is now a performance channel for apps” with Matilda Lindström, Associate Sales Director at Dataseat

Performance CTV is the phrase of the year - and today we're looking at what's actually behind it. For years, connected TV did one job: awareness. It was bought on reach and frequency, often upfront at fixed rates, with no way to tie an impression to an outcome. Now measurement has caught up and supply has flooded in, so the same channel can be linked to installs and conversions. To cover all this, we've got Matilda Lindström, Associate Sales Director at Dataseat, talking to tech journalist David Murphy at Business of Apps New York about connecting CTV with mobile user acquisition. Matilda explains what changed to make performance possible on CTV, why so many CTV tests look like failures when they aren't, and how MMP attribution settings can decide a campaign before it starts. She also covers second-screening and where to begin if you've never run CTV for performance. If you work in user acquisition, app marketing, or brand media, this is a clear look at how to run CTV and mobile as one strategy. Today’s topics include: What performance CTV means - still a great brand channel, but now measurable and optimizable in real time Measurement and supply - MMPs support CTV attribution, and free ad-supported streaming has pushed inventory ahead of demand Programmatic buying - bidding into inventory, shifting budgets mid-campaign, and capping frequency across publishers and placements The organizational challenge - CTV sits with brand teams, UA with mobile teams, each with different KPIs Attribution settings - probabilistic IP matching and MMP defaults that can make a working campaign look like it isn't A unified CTV and mobile strategy - second-screening, and a Sunday-night TV ad that pays off with a Monday-morning install Where to start - keep direct brand buys, scale programmatically, and check your MMP's CTV windows and prioritization Links and Resources: Matilda Lindström on LinkedIn Dataseat website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Matilda Lidström "I don't think that we should shy away from the fact that it's a great brand channel. That part hasn't changed. What changed is the ability to measure and optimize in real time." "You might look like the performance is not working at all, but it's actually not a performance issue. It's a settings issue." "I think that the most disappointing CTV tests are the ones that were decided by settings that no one looked at." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

September 28, 2026Episode 27518 min

275: “Your app can't win AI without winning search” with Dave Bell, CEO at Gummicube

This time, we're talking about the practical impact of AI on app store optimization - and why LLMs aren't about to pull app discovery out of the stores. LLMs are changing how people search the web. But app discovery has stayed inside the App Store and Google Play for 16 years, and the stores are now adding AI layers of their own. To cover all this, we've got Dave Bell, Co-Founder and CEO of Gummicube, about how AI is reshaping ASO on the App Store and Google Play. Dave explains why winning in-store search is what earns an app a place in Apple's and Google's AI recommendation layers, and why reviews, Custom Product Pages, and Android vitals now count as AI signals. He also covers the risk of "AI cannibalization" when competing apps use generic prompts to write their metadata, the store policies and copyright issues around AI-generated content, and why your website, social, and store listing need to tell the same story. If you work in app store optimization, app marketing, or app growth, this is a clear look at what AI actually changes in the stores - and what it doesn't. Today’s topics include: App discovery stays in the stores - web downloads remain in the single digits, and LLMs will take share from web search, not from the App Store Search feeds AI - the organic signals that power in-store search also fuel Siri, Spotlight, personalized collections, and Ask Play New AI ranking signals - ratings and reviews, Custom Product Pages linked to organic terms, and Android vitals all affect how AI positions your app AI cannibalization - generic LLM prompts produce identical listings, lower conversion, and risk store penalties under Apple and Google Play spam policies Content cohesion - aligning your website, social, and structured content with your store listing so LLMs find one consistent story Links and Resources: Dave Bell on LinkedIn Gummicube website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Dave Bell “LLMs are absolutely going to eat search.” "AI is great for research, but it's not great for creation." “You don't want to have a web page that communicates one thing, and a store listing that communicates another.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

August 31, 2026Episode 27438 min

274: “The Influencer Playbook: Flo, Numan & HelloFresh on the Future of Growth” BOA London 2026 panel

Today we're talking about influencer marketing - and about the point where creator content stops being a brand play and starts being a performance channel. Creator-led ads run four times better on click-through rate than the same brand's own ads. So the question is no longer whether to use influencers. It's how to scale them without losing the ROI. In this episode, we bring you a live panel hosted by Lucia Aguilar , CEO and Founder at TATAM Digital , featuring: Joanna Malecka , Partnership Director at Numan Esma Ebnu , Influencer Marketing at Flo Health Lia Darozhkina , Senior Influencer Marketing Manager at Trade Republic Stephanie Terziyski , Growth Influencer Marketing Manager at HelloFresh . The panel works through four trends. YouTube as the new TV - 13% of all US viewership and more ad revenue than Paramount, Disney, Universal, and Warner combined - and why long-form still converts for products that need explaining. Creator and partnership ads, where content boosted from the creator's own handle beats anything posted from a brand account. Regulation, with only 57% of UK paid posts tagged correctly, and how teams in health, Pharma, and banking build compliance into the brief instead of bolting it on at sign-off. And AI, from sourcing and brief writing through to forecasting campaign results, plus the case for human creators in a feed filling up with avatars. If you work in influencer marketing, user acquisition, or performance marketing, this is a practical look at where creator budgets are going in 2026 and what it takes to scale them profitably. The panel’s topics include: AI in growth teams — which tasks it already replaces, and why humans still own strategy Performance marketing's limits — why trust-driven categories like fintech need brand channels too Web-to-app funnels — near-double conversion rates and skipping the 30% app store tax Channel strategy for 2026 — fewer channels done better vs. always testing new ones Data and targeting vs. creative — where each wins, and the 96% CPA reduction story

August 24, 2026Episode 2737 min

273: How ASO and paid ads feed each other with Stephanie Ino, Client Services Manager at Gummicube

In this episode, we're talking about app store visibility - and about the fact that organic and paid aren't two separate budgets. Every channel you run, no matter where it starts, ends up on the same product page. And the platforms are watching what happens there. To cover all this, we've got Stephanie Ino, Client Services Manager at Gummicube, about how ASO and paid search feed each other on the App Store and Google Play. Stephanie explains why ASO is the home base every channel returns to, how Apple Ads and Google Ads send relevance signals back into the organic algorithm, and why the right split between the two depends on budget, app maturity, and how much relevance you've already built. She also covers Custom Product Pages and Custom Store Listings as a way to align paid traffic with the right creative, and why a younger app should build its ASO foundation before pushing paid spend through. If you work in app store optimization, user acquisition, or app growth, this is a clear look at how the paid and organic sides of the store actually connect. Today’s topics include: ASO as home base - metadata and creative work together because almost every channel routes users back to the product page or store listing Paid feeding organic - Apple Ads SERP placements and Google Ads Play Store placements both send relevance signals into the algorithm for the terms you're targeting Striking the balance - there's no blanket answer, it comes down to available budget, app size, and maturity in the storefront Younger apps first build relevance - get the ASO foundation and keyword rankings in place, then push paid traffic through at a lower acquisition cost Custom Product Pages and Custom Store Listings - matching store assets to each paid campaign's strategy so the traffic you buy actually converts Links and Resources: Stephanie Ino on LinkedIn Gummicube website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Stephanie Ino “ASO is where everything comes back to, kind of home base. Most of any channel will come back into that product page or that store listing.” "When we're running Apple Ads, particularly for those SERP results, it gives that boost in relevance so that Apple understands that we have better potential to then rank organically for those terms." “If we're working with a younger app in the storefront, we don't have that relevance built out yet within the algorithm. So we really want to focus on our organic and our ASO performance first.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

August 17, 2026Episode 27210 min

272: Why your app store A/B tests are misleading you with Scott Masters, Director of Strategy and Partnerships at Gummicube

Today we're talking about mobile A/B testing - and about the moment the app store hands you a winner. Because that result is directional, not the truth. And if most of your traffic is paid, you may have measured the wrong users entirely. In this episode, we speak with Scott Masters, Director of Strategy and Partnerships at Gummicube, about why mobile A/B testing is never set-and-forget. Scott explains why most developers and marketers under-invest in testing, what a sensible cadence looks like - once or twice a month, with each test running at least two weeks to reach statistical significance - and why changing one element at a time is the only way to know what actually moved the needle. If you work in app store optimization, user acquisition, or app growth, this is a practical guide to testing your product page properly. Today’s topics include: Why testing is never one-and-done - trends, user preferences, and app features all shift, and a static product page goes stale Cadence and statistical significance - test once or twice a month, run each test at least two weeks, with traffic volume determining how long One variable at a time - change the screenshot copy and the imagery together and you won't know which one worked What to test beyond screenshots - title, subtitle, short and full descriptions, icons, and feature graphics all feed the strategy Measuring what's real - platform confidence intervals are directional, so validate with pre- vs. post-deployment conversion rates across every channel Links and Resources: Scott Masters on LinkedIn Gummicube website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Scott Masters “If you're not A/B testing at least once or twice a month, you're leaving users out there for other competitors to take from you.” "It's not a one-and-done. You can't set it and forget it. It's just like with any other brand - you create a package for your product and you put it on the shelf. If it doesn't change over time, if you're not attracting those users with new materials or new approaches, it's going to get stale." “The platforms will give you an estimated conversion impact and confidence interval for each test you run. But that data is directional. True validation of performance really comes from launching a test winner into the store and then measuring the pre-deployment conversion rate versus the post-deployment conversion rate.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

August 10, 2026Episode 27118 min

#271: Why news app readers pay attention to your ads with Ramesh Ramalingam, VP of Product at SmartNews

In a world built to fragment your attention, one news app made the opposite bet: fewer ads, trusted sources, and users who actually stay. In this episode, we speak with Ramesh Ramalingam, VP of Product at SmartNews, about how a Japanese news app was rebuilt — not ported — for American users. Ramesh explains why SmartNews users spend 20 minutes per session, why 79% of them don't switch to another screen while reading, and how that focus turns into brand recall for advertisers. He also covers contextual targeting without cross-web tracking, why the product looks different in Tokyo than in Los Angeles, and how a revenue-share model keeps publishers in the loop. If you work in product, app growth, or media monetization, this is a conversation about building for engagement quality rather than scale. Today’s topics include: Engagement over scale — 20-minute average sessions and why 79% of users stay undistracted Monetization model — native brand and performance advertising, programmatic where it fits, plus SmartNews+ subscriptions in Japan Brand safety and privacy — contextual targeting, first-party data, and third-party validation instead of invasive tracking Japan to US expansion — high-density vs. clean-white-space design, local publisher partnerships, and building credibility from scratch Centralized vs. decentralized product development — core platform in Japan, market teams close to local users Links and Resources: Ramesh Ramalingam on LinkedIn Smartnews website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Ramesh Ramalingam “What is interesting about SmartNews is it's not about the scale. We're talking about 50 million, but it's more about the user engagement. Our users spend on average 20 minutes in our product, which is very high.” “From an advertiser perspective, yes, they do care about the reach, but trust is the most important aspect. We don't rely on invasive tracking across the web like other platforms do. What we built is a privacy-first, brand-safe environment.” “We didn't take the Japanese app and plug it into the US. We made sure that it is customized to the user preferences in the US, and it's built for American users.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

July 27, 2026Episode 27029 min

#270: “The Future of App Growth: Expert Interactive Panel” Business of Apps London 2026 panel

Everyone in app growth has an opinion on AI, web-to-app, and channel strategy — but few of those opinions ever get stress-tested in public. In this episode, we bring you a live panel debate featuring: Hannah Parvaz , Founder at Aperture Ewelina Pendino , App Growth & Performance Marketing Global Lead at Binance Veronica Lee , Global Performance Media Specialist at H&M . The format is simple: six provocative statements — from AI replacing growth roles to data versus creative — and the panel, along with a live audience voting in real time, has to agree or disagree. Along the way, you'll hear which growth tasks AI can already handle, why fintech can't rely on performance marketing alone, and how changing a single optimization event cut cost per acquisition by 96%. If you work in app growth, user acquisition, or performance marketing, this is what's real, what's noise, and what to try next week. The panel’s topics include: AI in growth teams — which tasks it already replaces, and why humans still own strategy Performance marketing's limits — why trust-driven categories like fintech need brand channels too Web-to-app funnels — near-double conversion rates and skipping the 30% app store tax Channel strategy for 2026 — fewer channels done better vs. always testing new ones Data and targeting vs. creative — where each wins, and the 96% CPA reduction story

July 20, 2026Episode 26945 min

#269: The performance channel app marketers wrote off with Mike Fogarty of Tatari and Lauren Frame of Greenlight

What if the channel you've written off as "brand-only" could measurably lift your Meta and Google performance? In this episode, tech journalist David Murphy is joined by Mike Fogarty, Head of Client Development at Tatari, and Lauren Frame, Director of Growth & Brand Media at Greenlight, to explore how a performance-first app brand turned TV from a scary experiment into an always-on channel that now accounts for over a third of its media mix. Whether you're a growth marketer watching CACs climb on paid social, wondering how to measure a channel without click-through attribution, or curious whether AI-produced creative can fight TV's fatigue problem, this conversation offers a practical framework for treating TV as a performance channel. Today’s topics include: What Tatari does differently from a DSP: convergent buying across streaming, linear, and online video, with direct network relationships Why Greenlight tapped out at 90% Meta and Google — paying more and more to reach the same non-converting users The "TV is for big brands" perception, and the lessons from going into the Super Bowl in year one Why you can't pick just linear or streaming: the Disney test that found less than 2% audience overlap The targeting opportunities streaming opens up for a parent-focused app How Tatari made TV feel like a digital channel: self-service activation, AI-powered planning, and real-time optimization Measuring TV: dynamic baseline lift, ACR data, MMP integrations, and Greenlight's stack of Rockerbox, iSpot, Kantar, and MMM Geo-based incrementality tests: streaming drove nearly 5x first-touch, new-to-brand customers vs. 1.1x for linear, with Meta reach up 4%, traffic up 8%, and funnel starts up 10% in test regions AI-produced commercials: Greenlight's Peter Pan spot, creative ethics, and solving creative fatigue with new messaging every quarter Honest advice for performance marketers still on the fence about testing TV Links and Resources: Lauren Frame on LinkedIn Greenlight website Mike Fogarty on LinkedIn Tatari website Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012