
Fewer Leads, More Tours: Why Quality Beats Quantity in Senior Living Marketing with Marissa Burkhardt - Chief Strategy Officer & Cliff Karklin - VP, Performance & Analytics at Fountain Digital
Most senior living marketing reports still lead with clicks, impressions, and cost per lead. Marissa Burkhardt and Cliff Karklin of Fountain Digital think that's the wrong scoreboard. In this episode we get into why fewer, better leads often produce more tours, what AI search is doing to your organic traffic, and what a real operator-agency partnership looks like when the numbers aren't all green arrows. KEY TAKEAWAYS Lead volume can drop while quality leads and tours go up. Track the conversion ratios, not just the top of the funnel. The cheapest cost per lead is rarely the best use of your next dollar. AI search is shrinking organic traffic for some communities, but the visitors who do click are further down the funnel. Generic AI-written content doesn't get cited. Content only your community could write does. If marketing data and CRM data aren't integrated, you can't prove what's working. Start there. TIMESTAMPS 00:00 Introduction01:32 Welcome, Marissa and Cliff02:56 Marissa's story: stumbling into senior living and falling for it04:13 Cliff's story: 20 years in data and how disconnected senior living felt05:54 Turning digital marketing into occupancy, not clicks08:43 Hitting a brick wall in the CRM, and why gut feelings hurt11:41 Can operators have lead quantity and quality?15:18 Where the tension shows up: budgets, conversion ratios, sales teams18:20 Frightening a sales team or two20:39 What AI search is doing to the data24:39 SEO fundamentals, amped up: quality, credibility, local authority26:55 Why cheap AI-generated content doesn't get picked up28:19 Moving beyond leads: defining a quality lead metric29:26 Attribution, and connecting dollars to tours34:27 What a productive operator-agency partnership looks like38:16 Transparent reporting and the end of spin40:47 The first thing to fix if you can't connect marketing to move-ins44:05 Their LeadingAge session: Marketing Data for CEOs46:13 Closing NOTABLE QUOTES "The lowest cost per lead is not necessarily going to be the best get for you." - Marissa Burkhardt "As a data guy, gut feelings can be painful." - Cliff Karklin "If you're never talking about something that didn't work, it usually means you're not talking about opportunities to improve." - Cliff Karklin MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE Fountain Digital: https://www.fountaindigital.com Marissa Burkhardt on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissaburkhardt/ Cliff Karklin on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cliffkarklin/ LeadingAge Annual Meeting, Oct. 25-28, 2026, Philadelphia: https://annualmeeting.leadingage.org/ "Marketing Data for CEOs" session with Springpoint Senior Living ABOUT THE GUESTS Marissa Burkhardt is Chief Strategy Officer at Fountain Digital, where she leads strategy and operations. She has spent more than a decade in senior living marketing and has led digital strategy for hundreds of clients, from senior living providers to Fortune 100 financial services companies. She has worked across the full digital funnel, from SEO and web to paid media and content, and focuses on tying marketing to tours, deposits, and move-ins. Cliff Karklin is VP, Performance & Analytics at Fountain Digital. Over 20 years on the agency side, he started in SEO, moved through client service, and found his calling building and growing data teams. After years in e-commerce, he came to senior living to close the gap between marketing activity and what actually happens in the CRM, with integrated attribution as the foundation. Enjoyed this one? Follow Connecting the Dots, share it with your sales and marketing team, and if you're in Philly for LeadingAge, go catch Marissa and Cliff's session. There may be t-shirts.















