That's What I Call Marketing

Hosted by Conor Byrne

Business MarketingInterviews guests

Website RSS feed

Episodes

222

Latest episode

Oct 2026

Language

About the show

That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features real conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Across the episodes, we explore the ideas, decisions and tensions shaping modern marketing: how brands are built, how B2B marketing is changing, how creativity drives effectiveness, how AI is reshaping the profession, and how marketers can earn a stronger role in the business. The show is for marketers who want more than tactics. It is for people who care about the craft, the evidence, the commercial impact and the human judgement behind great marketing. If you want marketing conversations with substance, practical insight and a point of view, That’s What I Call Marketing is for you. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Listen to episodes

60 recent

October 26, 202642 min

TWICM 222: Designing An Unmistakable Brand with Georgina Leigh-Pemberton MD Turner Duckworth

Georgina Leigh-Pemberton, Managing Director of Turner Duckworth London, joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss how design builds unmistakable brands, why restraint matters and how to make the business case for a redesign. You’ll understand how to identify the assets worth protecting, bring stakeholders with you and give a brand room to evolve while keeping what makes it recognisable. From Jim Beam’s porch to McDonald’s golden identity and Maker’s Mark’s red wax, Georgina explains how a brand’s history can provide the foundations for its future. We also explore what newer brands can learn from that approach, even when they have no archive to dig through. In this episode, we cover: – How distinctive brand assets support recognition, attribution and marketing effectiveness. – Why successful redesigns need stakeholder consensus and a clear commercial case. – The confidence it takes for established brands to resist chasing design trends. – How global brand guidelines can protect consistency while giving local teams creative freedom. – Why research means listening to consumers, then applying judgement to what you hear. – Where AI can help the design process and why learning the craft still matters. A vital listen for marketers interested in brand strategy, visual identity, distinctive brand assets, agency relationships and marketing effectiveness. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com PARTNER: TRACKSUIT This episode is supported by Tracksuit, the always-on brand tracking platform. Understand how your brand is performing, follow changes in awareness and consideration, and see how you compare with competitors. Find out more: https://www.gotracksuit.com CHAPTERS 03:34 From medieval history to advertising and design 06:27 Jim Beam: finding a brand world on the porch 08:22 Packaging, Yorkshire Tea and the move into design 10:53 The role of design in marketing effectiveness 13:21 Why design takes patience 14:32 Managing a redesign across complex organisations 15:49 McDonald’s: building consensus around the brand 17:46 Making the business case to CEOs and CFOs 19:09 Bringing clients into the creative process 20:10 Protecting the idea through stakeholder feedback 21:28 Why restraint takes confidence 23:24 Building a new brand without a long history 25:54 Reese’s: global consistency with room to play 27:17 Listening to consumers through research 28:35 Why the work continues after the guidelines 30:03 When brand identities become part of culture 31:09 Knowing what to preserve and what to change 33:20 AI, human craft and developing young talent 38:11 Sharing knowledge and learning from other agencies That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

October 21, 202636 min

TWICM 221: Make Your Mark Ep 2 with Dee Cunniam of Britvic Ireland

Dee Cunniam, Head of Brand Marketing and Innovation at Britvic Ireland, joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss growing iconic Irish brands, leading through change and building a marketing career that keeps moving forward. How do you adapt a much-loved brand without losing what people love about it? Through her work on MiWadi and Ballygowan, Dee explains how consumer insight, product innovation and commercial judgement come together and why 18 years in one business has meant many different careers. In this episode, we cover: – How MiWadi responded when concerns about sugar challenged perceptions of the brand, balancing functional benefits with its emotional connection to families. – The thinking behind MiWadi’s 0% sugar range and why innovation needs to preserve a brand’s distinctiveness. – Ballygowan’s expansion into flavoured and functional water, and what an earlier launch taught the team about consumer readiness. – Moving shopper marketing beyond point-of-sale execution to a more strategic role across brands, customers and commercial teams. – Building influence by understanding other functions’ priorities and demonstrating marketing’s commercial value. – Why sideways moves, category experience and continuous learning can help marketers build broader careers. A useful listen for marketers interested in brand strategy, FMCG marketing, consumer insight, product innovation, marketing leadership and career development. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com MAKE YOUR MARK — IN PARTNERSHIP WITH THE MARKETING INSTITUTE OF IRELAND This is the final episode in our three-part Make Your Mark series, exploring the different ways marketers develop their expertise, build confidence and make a meaningful contribution to their organisations. The Marketing Institute of Ireland supports marketers through its competency framework, professional assessment, certification, ongoing CPD and a network of peers. Thank you to the Marketing Institute for partnering with That’s What I Call Marketing on this series. Find out more: https://mii.ie TIMESTAMPS 02:51 From promotional work to agency life and FMCG 06:41 Britvic Ireland and its portfolio of brands 08:39 Eighteen years in one business, many different roles 09:17 MiWadi: protecting the brand while responding to change 13:00 Functional benefits, 0% sugar and product innovation 15:18 Making the commercial case for brand investment 16:17 Ballygowan: from mineral water to new drinking occasions 17:55 Balancing innovation with the core brand 19:37 How leadership changes as you become more senior 21:23 Giving shopper marketing a more strategic role 23:12 Building influence across the business 24:44 Making time for learning and development 28:53 Squiggly careers, sideways moves and category experience 31:13 What marketing awards mean for the whole team 32:51 The mark Dee still wants to make 34:22 Club Orange, football and having fun along the way That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

October 14, 202636 min

TWICM 220: Make Your Mark Ep 2 with Stephanie Bell of Mercedes Ireland

Make Your Mark: Stephanie Bell, Head of Marketing for Mercedes-Benz in Ireland joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss building commercial credibility, making a global brand relevant locally and earning support for ambitious marketing. You’ll hear what “speaking the language of the business” actually looks like, how Stephanie secured backing for The Traitors Ireland partnership and why building relationships with future buyers matters alongside delivering sales today. When sales fall, pausing marketing can seem like the obvious response. Stephanie shares how she challenged that thinking by starting with the revenue target, working back to the number of customers needed and explaining how marketing would help deliver them. That commercial grounding runs through a career spanning Diageo, Heineken, FMCG, not-for-profit and automotive. It also shaped her approach to The Traitors Ireland: a partnership the business initially turned down, which went on to deliver almost 30 minutes of on-screen car exposure. Stephanie discusses the 40% year-on-year growth in GLC sales that followed, the lessons from the first series and the creation of four locally produced Irish TV ads for the second. In this episode, we cover: – What commercial and trade marketing roles taught Stephanie about customers, margins and making a case for investment. – Working on Orchard Thieves and adapting lessons from Diageo and Heineken to businesses where marketing has to earn its influence. – Securing local and global approval for The Traitors Ireland, with conviction rather than certainty. – Why Irish creative and cultural relevance matter, even when you have a globally recognised luxury brand. – Balancing immediate sales with future demand across Mercedes-Benz and BYD, while responding to electrification and changing buyer behaviour. – Making professional development part of the working day and helping a team build its skills and confidence. A useful listen for marketers interested in brand strategy, sponsorship effectiveness, commercial impact, global and local marketing, marketing leadership and career development. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com MAKE YOUR MARK | IN PARTNERSHIP WITH THE MARKETING INSTITUTE OF IRELAND This is episode two of our three-part Make Your Mark series, created in partnership with the Marketing Institute of Ireland. The series explores different routes through a marketing career and how marketers make their mark through expertise, confidence, continued learning and the impact of their work. The Marketing Institute of Ireland supports marketers through its competency framework, professional assessment and certification, CPD and training. Find out more: https://mii.ie TIMESTAMPS 02:55 Stephanie’s path from commercial roles into marketing 04:47 Learning brand marketing at Diageo and Heineken 06:15 Orchard Thieves and challenging the cider category 07:56 Bringing big-company experience into smaller businesses 10:02 “Sales are down”: making the commercial case for marketing 12:26 Building credibility with commercial stakeholders 13:40 From FMCG and not-for-profit into automotive 15:33 Managing Mercedes-Benz in Ireland: global brand, local market 18:50 The Traitors Ireland: taking the risk and securing support 22:23 Creating Irish TV ads for the second series 23:48 Conviction rather than certainty 25:08 Balancing current sales and future buyers 27:52 Electrification and the better-informed car buyer 28:38 Developing your own skills and supporting your team 32:27 Challenging “we’ve always done it that way” 34:27 Winning Best Entertainment Sponsorship That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

October 7, 202631 min

TWICM 219: Make Your Mark Ep 1 with John Kelly of Musgraves

Make Your Mark is a three-part series exploring how marketers build their careers and make a difference to their businesses, their customers and the people around them, in partnership with the Marketing Institute of Ireland. In this opening conversation, John Kelly, Retail Marketing Manager at Musgrave, joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss his 20-year career working predominantly with SuperValu, and what it takes to turn customer understanding into commercial results. John’s experience shows how much you can learn by taking on different challenges within one organisation. From checking promotional prices as a marketing assistant to delivering campaigns across a network of independent retailers, he explains how attention to detail, curiosity and doing what you said you would do build the credibility to take your next step. We also get into the work behind SuperValu’s “Yes You Scan” campaign. Getting TV, radio, social and in-store communications working together is one challenge; getting the entire business, right down to the checkout, moving towards the same outcome is another. In this episode, we cover: – How John deliberately built experience across value, local marketing, loyalty, sponsorship and retail marketing. – The commercial thinking and business-wide coordination behind Real Rewards prices and “Yes You Scan”. – What independent retailers know about their communities, and how that knowledge complements customer research and sales data. – Keeping SuperValu distinctive while competing on value and delivering short-term sales. – What John learned from micromanaging, and how he now uses trust, accountability and regular feedback to develop his team. – Why the time AI saves should help marketers get closer to customers, alongside the continuing need for creativity and storytelling. A useful listen for marketers interested in career development, retail marketing, brand building, customer insight, marketing effectiveness and leadership. TIMESTAMPS 00:00 Consumer understanding and storytelling 00:23 Introducing the Make Your Mark series 03:08 John Kelly’s route into marketing 04:00 Musgrave and SuperValu’s retailer model 05:00 Different roles, new challenges and career development 06:23 Commercial outcomes and attention to detail 08:19 Why John’s team hears “never assume” 10:21 Building credibility by following through 11:00 Real Rewards prices and “Yes You Scan” 12:12 Getting the whole business behind a campaign 13:11 Competition, pace and brand differentiation 15:34 Customer insight and the say-do gap 16:47 Short-term sales and long-term brand building 18:21 Learning to lead without micromanaging 20:10 Mentoring and finding answers as a leader 22:19 The attitude and skills John looks for when hiring 25:37 Using AI to get closer to customers 27:00 Demonstrating marketing’s business impact 28:12 Recognising marketing talent through awards 30:24 Make Your Mark and continuous learning That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com OUR SERIES PARTNER Thank you to the Marketing Institute of Ireland for partnering with us on this series as part of their Make Your Mark campaign. The campaign recognises that making your mark happens throughout your career: as you develop your skills, grow in confidence, take responsibility and help others progress. Across three conversations with marketers working in different organisations and at different career stages, we explore what that means in practice. The Marketing Institute of Ireland helps marketers build their expertise and professional credibility through its competency framework, professional assessment, certification and ongoing CPD. That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

October 5, 202628 min

TWICM 218: The Singles: Grindr IRL with Madonna, ON taking On Nike, Walkers Little Moments of Joy

Bella Harrison and Ed Parkin from Tracksuit join That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss Grindr’s push into real-world experiences, On’s entry into football and Walkers’ growing brand preference, exploring what each story tells marketers about building brands and measuring progress. Three brands, three different challenges: giving people more reasons to use an app, taking a specialist sports brand to a wider audience, and keeping an established favourite relevant. Conor Byrne, Bella and Ed examine the strategies alongside Tracksuit’s brand health data, discussing what is moving, what remains uncertain and which measures matter. In this episode, we cover: – Grindr’s “Global Gayborhood” ambition: how a surprise Madonna performance, events and broader services support its move beyond a hook-up app, and why its younger audience deserves closer attention. – On’s move into football with Kylian Mbappé and Thierry Henry: building on its running and tennis credentials, competing with Nike and adidas, and the questions facing a premium brand entering the boot market. – The difference between recognising a brand and thinking of it first, and how expanding into another sport could give On more opportunities to come to mind. – Walkers’ brand refresh, new flavours and football partnerships with Lionel Messi, David Beckham and Thierry Henry, alongside a rise in preference from 29% to 36%. – Why flat awareness or usage figures do not tell the whole story, and how audience differences, category context and preference can help marketers make a stronger case for their work. – “What the Actual?”: the discussion around Sydney Sweeney’s Novig campaign, PNC Bank using the Titanic in its advertising, and why the Laughing Cow has stopped laughing. A useful listen for marketers interested in brand strategy, customer insight, experiential marketing, sports marketing, brand building, marketing effectiveness and commercial impact. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com THE SINGLES — IN PARTNERSHIP WITH TRACKSUIT The Singles is our monthly look at the marketing stories getting people talking, using Tracksuit’s brand tracking data to bring evidence and context to the conversation. A huge thanks to Tracksuit for supporting the series, and to Bella Harrison and Ed Parkin for helping us understand the brand performance behind the headlines. Explore Tracksuit’s always-on, affordable brand tracking platform: https://www.gotracksuit.com TIMESTAMPS 01:50 Grindr: real-world events and the “Global Gayborhood” 02:58 Madonna, community and experiences people share 04:08 What the brand data shows for Grindr 05:33 Reaching younger audiences in a changing dating category 06:41 Putting audience and category data into context 07:37 Giving people reasons to use Grindr beyond dating 09:14 On enters football with Kylian Mbappé 10:08 Building on running and tennis 10:53 Premium positioning and the realities of buying football boots 13:06 On’s brand growth and the opportunity to come to mind more often 14:36 Thierry Henry joins On as Director of Football 15:16 Thierry Henry and Ireland’s long football memory 16:10 Walkers: refreshing an iconic brand 17:45 Why Walkers’ seven-point preference gain matters 19:46 Competing across the wider snacking category 21:25 Familiarity, trust and choosing a brand 22:05 Using brand metrics in budget conversations 23:27 What the Actual? Sydney Sweeney and Novig 25:10 PNC Bank’s Titanic advertising 26:08 The Laughing Cow stops laughing: one to watch That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

September 29, 202652 min

TWICM 217: Rich Silverstein Co-Founder of Goodby Silverstein & Partners on 40 Years in Advertising

On the day he retires from Goodby Silverstein & Partners, co-founder Rich Silverstein joins That’s What I Call Marketing to reflect on 40 years in advertising, the making of ‘Got Milk?’ and what makes an idea last. Rich takes us back to the early days of the agency, when a project for Electronic Arts helped turn a group of creatives who wanted to do things their own way into a business. We get into the thinking behind ‘Got Milk?’, the E*TRADE monkey ad and the lizards, and ask whether work made for a different media era could be even more powerful today. Rich is candid about the role of craft, humour and client confidence, as well as his concern that AI could make it easier to settle for work that is merely good enough. In this episode, we cover: – How Rich, Jeff Goodby and Andy Berlin started the agency, and what they took from their time with Hal Riney – The simple truth behind ‘Got Milk?’ and how its words and distinctive look came together – Why the best campaigns build a brand over time, rather than end with one commercial – What it takes to sell an unusual idea when more people want a say in the work – Rich’s mixed feelings about AI, and how he is using it to develop a musical – Why he tells young creatives to study the world and the people in it A useful listen for marketers interested in brand building, creative effectiveness, advertising craft, agency relationships and AI in marketing. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Timestamps 00:00 – Rich Silverstein and 40 years in advertising 10:01 – Hal Riney, Electronic Arts and starting Goodby Silverstein & Partners 14:28 – Bringing design, journalism and craft together 15:25 – Why Rich skips most advertising 16:31 – AI and the danger of “good enough” 21:46 – What editorial design and Rolling Stone taught him 24:05 – Why great work should still hold up years later 24:26 – The story behind ‘Got Milk?’ 26:00 – The E*TRADE monkey ad 28:37 – Creative constraints and the need for confident clients 30:36 – The lizards and building a brand over time 33:15 – Using humour to make an idea last 36:32 – Selling ambitious work and working with clients 37:39 – Research, planning and creative collaboration 40:37 – The ideas Rich loved but could not sell 41:59 – 13 Days , his musical project, and using AI to make it 46:47 – Advice for creatives starting an agency today 49:19 – Why the ideas come faster, but selling them remains hard 51:51 – The advertising Rich still admires 52:46 – Mentors, observation and studying the world Thanks to Tracksuit for partnering with That’s What I Call Marketing. Find out more about its always-on brand tracking platform at https://www.gotracksuit.com . That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

September 21, 202644 min

TWICM 216: Scribd CMO Gemma Craven on the Path to becoming CMO, Building Range, Reputation & Impact

Gemma Craven, Chief Marketing Officer at Scribd, Inc., joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss her path to becoming a CMO, the value of building experience across different areas of marketing and what it takes to reshape brands, teams and reputations. This episode explores how a varied career across PR, social media, technology, agencies, consultancy and in-house leadership gave Gemma the range required to lead marketing across Scribd, Everand, Fable and SlideShare. It is an honest conversation about career choices that did not always make immediate sense to other people. In this episode, we cover: – How moving between countries, disciplines and organisations shaped Gemma’s approach to marketing leadership – Building Social@Ogilvy New York when many people still believed social media would not last – Why Gemma deliberately moved beyond being known solely as a social media specialist – How working with CMOs at McCann helped her see CMO leadership as a possible destination – Why becoming a fractional CMO was initially viewed as a failure by some people – Restructuring Scribd’s marketing organisation around its products, audiences and areas of expertise – Managing a portfolio that includes Scribd, Everand, Fable and SlideShare – Why brands must actively manage their reputations rather than leave customers, reviews and online communities to define them – Connecting brand strategy more closely with product, engineering, design and customer experience – The thinking behind Scribd’s “Connect the Docs” campaign and the enduring human satisfaction of figuring something out for yourself Gemma Craven has more than 25 years of experience building and positioning global brands. Before joining Scribd, Inc., she led marketing at Melissa & Doug, advised senior leaders at companies including Spotify, Nike, Fiverr and Ford, and led digital brand strategy at McCann New York, where she helped make Fearless Girl a global phenomenon. She also built Social@Ogilvy New York into an award-winning, multi-practice division. A useful listen for marketers interested in marketing leadership, career development, brand strategy, organisational design, reputation management, customer experience and the path to becoming a CMO. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession.Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com This episode is brought to you in partnership with Tracksuit, the always-on brand-tracking platform that helps marketers monitor brand health and bring a clear, shared view of brand performance into the boardroom. Tracksuit tracks brands across more than 25 markets, making ongoing brand measurement more accessible, visible and useful for marketing teams and senior leaders. Find out more at: https://www.gotracksuit.com The Big Marketing MeetUp Belfast, takes place at ICC Belfast on 5 November 2026, book tickets at: https://www.tickettailor.com/events/bmmubelfast/1935249 Chapters 04:15 – A career shaped by curiosity and working across cultures 06:30 – Moving from London to New York and experiencing culture shock 09:41 – Building Social@Ogilvy New York 16:42 – Why Gemma moved from agency life into technology 19:24 – When becoming a CMO started to feel possible 20:49 – Why varied experience creates better marketing leaders 23:13 – Too ambitious to work for Mick Jagger 24:01 – Choosing the fractional CMO path 28:11 – Restructuring marketing around products and audiences 29:17 – What happens when a brand leaves its story untold 29:48 – Leading teams through organisational change 32:16 – Refreshing the Scribd and SlideShare brands 32:24 – The strategy behind “Connect the Dots” 36:26 – Resisting the pressure to launch a campaign too quickly 38:06 – How brand discovery and reputation are changing That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

September 14, 202630 min

TWICM 215: The Singles: Monzo’s Get Busy Living, Heinz x Heineken & is Meta X Ray‑Ban creepy?

Conor Byrne hosts another “Singles” episode with Bella and Ed from Tracksuit, using brand tracking data to unpack the biggest marketing stories of the moment—what’s genuinely driving brand growth, what’s just noise, and where brands are taking real risks. From Monzo’s bold “Get Busy Living” brand campaign in a fiercely competitive banking market, to the clever Heinz x Heineken collaboration built for summer BBQ culture, they explore how creativity and brand equity show up in the metrics. They also break down quick-fire eclipse “culture-jacking” wins from brands like Starbucks, Netflix and Mastercard, before debating the backlash and brand danger around Meta-powered Ray-Ban smart glasses. Finally, they launch “What the Actual?”—spotlighting recent brand missteps from Target and a Callaway/Good Good promo—and invite listeners to submit their own. 02:05 Monzo Brand Campaign 13:02 Heinz Heineken Collab 18:37 Solar Eclipse Marketing 22:55 Meta Ray Ban Glasses 27:28 What The Actual Fails Check out tracksuit https://www.gotracksuit.com/ That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

September 7, 202646 min

TWICM 214: James Hurman Future Demand, Making the Commercial Case for Brand Investment

James Hurman, author of Future Demand and co-founder of Tracksuit, joins That’s What I Call Marketing to explain how brand building creates future demand, how performance marketing converts current demand and why marketers need both to drive sustainable growth. This episode offers a practical way to understand how advertising really works, how to build the internal case for brand investment and how marketers can move an organisation beyond a performance-only mindset without betting everything on one dramatic change. In this episode, we cover: – Why James Hurman rewrote Future Demand specifically for marketers – The relationship between brand building, future demand and performance marketing – Why advertising rarely causes an immediate sale but can help a brand win a greater share of future sales – How Instacart CMO Laura Jones “marched up the funnel” from measurable performance activity to the Olympics and the Super Bowl – How Telstra tested a 50:50 brand and performance split in Adelaide and recorded a 14% improvement against the rest of Australia – How marketers can use experiments, geographic holdouts and better measurement to demonstrate incrementality – Why CEOs, CFOs and marketers often want the same commercial outcome but describe marketing investment in very different language – What AI, agentic shopping, AEO and GEO could change — and why the fundamentals of markets, brands and human decision-making still matter James challenges the traditional idea that advertising works by persuading somebody to buy immediately. Instead, he describes a two-stage process: brand advertising creates familiarity and positive bias among people who are not yet in the market, while performance activity helps convert that existing bias when they are ready to buy. He also shares practical examples of how marketers can earn confidence gradually, measure brand investment more rigorously and communicate its commercial value to non-marketing stakeholders. That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com CHAPTERS 03:47 Exploring what a marketing book can be 05:40 Why James rewrote Future Demand 07:39 Creating future demand and converting current demand 08:29 Laura Jones and Instacart’s four-year brand journey 11:03 How Instacart “marched up the funnel” 12:00 Telstra’s geographic holdout test in Adelaide 14:16 Making marketing science easier to understand 16:11 The wrong mental model for advertising 17:44 How advertising creates and converts demand 19:06 Is advertising really a weak force? 20:07 Why the evidence has not changed every organisation 21:43 Winning support from non-marketing stakeholders 23:38 Creating a shared language with CFOs 25:18 Why James remains invested in solving this problem 26:56 How marketing cultures differ across markets 29:53 Better marketing measurement and experimentation 31:27 Using AI to learn and improve marketing capability 34:14 How AI is affecting businesses and marketing 37:21 Will agentic shopping change consumer behaviour? 39:58 Familiarity, emotion and why people choose brands 40:58 What McDonald’s “brand love” metric predicts 42:19 Tracksuit University and the language of the boardroom 44:25 Where to find Future Demand ABOUT JAMES HURMAN James Hurman is the author of Future Demand and The Case for Creativity . He is a co-founder of Tracksuit and founding partner of innovation studio Previously Unavailable. His work focuses on marketing effectiveness, creativity, brand building and helping businesses understand how marketing contributes to long-term commercial growth. Explore Future Demand : https://future-demand.com Learn more about Tracksuit: https://www.gotracksuit.com Visit Tracksuit University: https://university.gotracksuit.com That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

August 31, 202636 min

TWICM 213: Mark Kingsley on Brands in the Age of AI

Mark Kingsley, brand strategist, designer, author and founder of Malcontent, joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss his book "Brands in the Age of AI" and why marketers need to think much more deeply about artificial intelligence than prompts, productivity and tools. Mark’s central argument is that AI is not simply a tool, it is a condition, an environment that is already changing how we work, create, build brands and relate to one another. This conversation explores what that means for brand strategy, creativity, marketing careers and the relationship between companies and customers. Rather than offering another AI how-to guide that could be outdated within months, Mark draws on history, philosophy, psychology, design and technology to understand where AI fits into a much longer story of technological change. In this episode, we cover: – What the Jacquard loom, Charles Babbage, Ada Lovelace, Alan Turing and even *Frankenstein* can teach us about today’s AI debate – AI-driven job losses, automation and the continued commoditisation of creative and knowledge work – Why removing junior-level “donkey work” could create a serious skills and judgement problem for agencies, marketers and professional services – Brian Eno’s idea of “scenius” and why creativity is rarely the product of a lone genius – Agentic AI, B2A2C commerce and what happens when AI agents begin making purchasing decisions – Why brands could use AI to move beyond transactions towards deeper relationships with people – Why human discernment could become more valuable as AI becomes more capable – The danger of treating AI primarily as another system for extracting efficiency and profit – How AI might instead be used to support human flourishing One of the most important questions running through the conversation is what happens to expertise when AI starts doing the work through which people traditionally learned their craft. We also explore what AI means for brands themselves. If brands genuinely want relationships rather than simply transactions, Mark argues AI could help companies recognise people as individuals and members of communities rather than merely customers to extract value from. A useful listen for marketers interested in AI in marketing, brand strategy, creativity, marketing leadership, agentic AI, synthetic research, the future of work, customer experience and the changing role of human judgement. 02:32 Why this is not another AI how-to book 04:36 “AI is not a tool, it’s a condition” 05:43 Technology, Heidegger and what technology reveals 07:38 Is AI already changing society at scale? 08:01 Alan Turing and the history of machine intelligence 09:02 Jacquard looms, the Luddites and automation 11:04 AI layoffs and the economics of replacing people 13:36 AI infrastructure and removing barriers 19:13 Photography, creativity and resistance to new technology 20:18 Why great photographers and creatives still matter 21:24 Brian Eno’s Oblique Strategies 25:18 Agentic AI and B2A2C commerce 26:00 AI personas and purchasing agents 27:02 Tokenisation and the “semiotic gap” between humans and agents 30:48 Why Mark is disappointed by the adversarial AI debate 34:13 What *Brands in the Age of AI* ultimately asks brands to reconsider This episode is brought to you by Tracksuit the always-on brand tracking platform for clients and agencies. Find out more: https://www.gotracksuit.com More from That’s What I Call Marketing That’s What I Call Marketing is the podcast for marketers who care about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Follow the show for more conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, professors, authors, thinkers and practitioners. Find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession. Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice. Listen, follow and find more episodes at: https://www.thatswhaticallmarketing.com Connect with Conor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/conorbyrneirl/ If you enjoy the show, please follow, subscribe and leave a review. It helps more marketers find the conversations. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.