Leadermorphosis

Hosted by Lisa Gill and Tuff Leadership Training

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100

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Jun 2026

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About the show

Leadermorphosis is a podcast exploring the emerging world of self-managing teams and progressive organisations. Hosted by Lisa Gill, who was named on the Thinkers50 Radar 2020 list, each episode features a guest thought leader or practitioner offering a unique perspective on new and innovative ways of working. "Turning self-managed teams from a good idea into reality is a big challenge and Lisa Gill is leading the way in making it happen." – Thinkers50 Leadermorphosis is powered by Tuff Leadership Training, a team of consultants and coaches who specialise in transformational leadership training, shifting working climates and supporting organisations to become self-managing.

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60 recent

June 12, 2026Episode 1041 hr 10 min

Ep. 104 Angela Williamson on the inner and outer development work at self-managing care organisation Chorus

Chorus was born out of the merger of three traditionally structured care organisations in 2017, but today its 1,000 employees work in 20+ self-managing, local teams. Strategic Coach Angela Williamson share this remarkable transformation story and how inner development – and not just structural development – has been key. Chorus began as an experiment asking the question: "What if the people closest to the work were trusted to make most decisions themselves?" Resources: Corporate Rebels' blog about Chorus and their organisational model Chorus website https://chorus.org.au/ Mia Mingus on the Nothing Never Happens podcast talking about reimagining accountability My blog about the tyranny of the inner boss Related Leadermorphosis episodes: Ep. 69 with Jos de Blok, founder of Buurtzorg Ep. 26 with the nurses at Buurtzorg Ep. 96 with Xavier Costa about love in self-managing organisations Ep. 67 with Andy Brogan and Helen Sanderson about Confirmation Practices Ep. 85 with Bernadette Wesley about Deliberately Developmental Organisations

April 20, 2026Episode 1031 hr 10 min

Ep. 103 Rodrigo Ventre on emancipating 1,000 people (and himself) at a Brazilian waste-management company

If you ask employees at EPPO who the CEO is, they will answer: there is no CEO! In this episode, Rodrigo Ventre shares the story of transforming his father's company into a self-managing organisation. We talk about his lifelong passion for human development and the increasingly radical experiments he has encouraged in the domains of business, culture, and governance. It was not an easy journey, but today EPPO is celebrated in Brazil for its innovative organisational model and being an inspiring place to work. This episode is a warts-and-all story including insights from a systems level, but also from Rodrigo as a father and a human being. Resources: The EPPO case study from INSEAD More about Target Teal in Brazil (where you can also learn more about Organic Organization or O2) Related Leadermorphosis episodes: Ep. 70 with Ravi Resck on the future of work movement in Brazil Ep. 41 with Michael Y. Lee on what the academic world is learning about decentralised organisations Ep. 55 with Frederic Laloux, author of Reinventing Organisations

March 5, 2026Episode 1021 hr 1 min

Ep. 102 Natacha Neumann on why org transformation is 80 percent mindset, 20 percent structure

Natacha is the co-founder of Freche Freunde, a leading children's healthy snacks brand. She shares insights from the two-year transformation journey she led at the 80-person company – what she says were the hardest two years of her life. Through experiments with Holacracy and self-management, the biggest challenge turned out to be her own personal development. In this honest and beautiful story, Natacha shares the ups and downs of the process and what her next adventures will be. Resources: Natacha's conversation with friend of the pod Manuel Küblböck Related Leadermorphosis episodes: Ep. 49 with Peter Koenig about Source Ep. 94 with SINA, Uganda

January 21, 2026Episode 1011 hr 5 min

Ep. 101 Abhijith HK and Vidhya Abhijith from Codewave on scaling culture without hierarchy

Abhijith HK and Vidhya Abhijith are co-founders of Codewave, a digital innovation company in India with over 200 employees and zero hierarchy. In this episode, we explore how they built a self-managing organisation from intuition, their peer-based feedback system called Peerly, and how they moved from "ruinous empathy" to radical candor. We also discuss scaling through "Fractas" (mini startups within the company), staying bootstrapped to protect culture, and the personal growth required of founders on this journey. Resources: Link to Codewave's handbook Corporate Rebels' blog about Codewave Related Leadermorphosis episodes: Ep. 41 with Michael Y. Lee

December 5, 2025Episode 1001 hr 20 min

Ep. 100 Eva, Trevor and Kajsa from Tuff on the messy beauty of working in a self-managing organisation

For episode 100, Lisa talks with her colleagues Eva Vilella, Trevor Hudson, and Kajsa Thelander Sadio from Tuff Leadership Training about what it's really like to work inside a self-managing organisation. They explore how working at Tuff has transformed each of them, their culture of continuous development with practices like "pebbles" and "mooseheads," and the genuine challenges alongside the beauty – from coordination difficulties to the loneliness of autonomy. A rare inside look at self-management with all its complexity, humor, and humanity. Resources: Moose Heads on the Table – book by Lisa and Karin from Tuff Lisa's blog, 'The tyranny of the inner boss' Trevor's blog about relationship conversations at work Related Leadermorphosis episodes: Ep. 12 with Karin Tenelius, co-founder of Tuff Ep. 85 with Bernadette Wesley on Deliberately Developmental Organisations

September 8, 2025Episode 991 hr 21 min

Ep. 99 Perttu Salovaara on Radically Decentralised Organisations and leaderless leadership

If we want to practise alternatives to hierarchy, what needs to be in place? Perttu has twenty years' experience as an organisational consultant and I've been really enjoying his research papers on Radically Decentralised Organisations. We talk about the four things needed for a Radically Decentralised Organisation to be sustainable, leaderless leadership, group dynamics we need to be aware of, and some interesting case studies in Finland, particularly in the public sector. Resources: Perttu's paper, "Leaderless Leadership in Radically Decentralised Organisations" https://www.researchgate.net/publication/380008457_Leaderless_leadership_in_radically_decentralized_organizations Perttu's website: https://perttusalovaara.com/en/ Related Leadermorphosis podcast episodes: Ep. 37 with Miki Kashtan Ep. 78 with Sofia and Luís from Mindera Ep. 41 with Michael Y. Lee

August 8, 2025Episode 981 hr 10 min

Ep. 98 Timea Kristof on the factors for a successful succession process

Handing the baton over to someone else can be risky, especially when it's your company you're handing over. Timea Kristof shares her research on six key factors necessary for a successful succession process to happen, and one of the most important factors might surprise you. It's love. Timea shares insights from her research, including examples of organisations she interviewed such as a family business with three generations of failed successions, as well as her own lived experience of handovers. We also discuss Peter Koenig's Source Work and how this is a helpful lens when thinking about succession. And we also share some personal learning moments as people pleasers in recovery! Resources: Timea's website and research https://www.gekko.consulting/founder-succession-research/ The webinar recording of Timea presenting her research for ConsciousU Read more about Source Work: Tom Nixon's book Work with Source A Little Red Book About Source by Stefan Merckelbach Nadja Taranczewski's programme, CU Source: https://www.conscious-u.com/cusource/ Related Leadermorphosis podcast episodes: Ep. 49 with Peter Koenig about Source Ep. 5 with Tom Nixon

July 25, 2025Episode 971 hr 10 min

Ep. 97 Allan Rhodes on organisational gardening and Konsileo

Allan Rhodes is Chief People Officer at teal-inspired insurance broker Konsileo. He shares what he's learned over the last three years about helping to design a self-managing organisation, including how to onboard people into a totally new way of working. We also talk about his favourite metaphor of organisational gardening. We can be inspired by other gardens and gardeners, but what will grow best in our unique soil and climate? Allan has dual nationality as a Mexican Englishman so he shares observations on the two cultures having experienced communities exploring progressive ways of organising in both Latin America and the UK. Resources: Konsileo's website: https://konsileo.com/ Allan's blogs about Organisational Gardening Latin American networks and organisations promoting self-management: Co-crealia: https://www.linkedin.com/company/cocrealia/ Pancho Mora's podcast, Autogestión: https://panchomora.life/ Organizaciones Brillantes: https://www.organizacionesbrillantes.com/el-movimiento Brave Job: https://www.brave-job.com/home/ CultureSee: https://www.culturesee.com/ Outiopía: https://ouitopia.team/en/ Luis Salas - Polymath - Reinventando a tu Organización (newsletter): https://www.linkedin.com/in/luis-salas-0b7b7135/ Encuentro Internacional Teal: https://www.congresointernacionalteal.com/ Related Leadermorphosis podcast episodes: Ep. 49 with Peter Koenig about Source Ep. 5 with Tom Nixon Ep. 82 with Mayden, another UK self-managing company Ep. 52 with Jorge Silva from 10Pines, Argentina Ep. 96 with Xavier Costa about the movement in Spain Ep. 33 with Margaret Wheatley

July 10, 2025Episode 961 hr 10 min

Ep. 96 Xavier Costa on lessons from self-managing organisations in Spain

Why does Spain appear to be a hotbed for progressive organisations lately? Xavier Costa shares three hypotheses: the implementation of the NER self-management approach in over 100 companies, a rich history of cooperatives, and a culture of innovation in the boundaries of Spain. We also talk about lessons learned from Xavier's experience of transforming companies, both with consultancy Full Circle Team, and investment fund Krisos, which buys and transforms companies. How do you rebalance salaries? How do you support former managers? And what is the 'healing' and personal transformation journey needed for self-organisation to work? Resources: Full Circle Team website: https://www.fullcircleteam.es/ Krisos website: https://krisos.eu/ A Corporate Rebels blog about Indaero's 'no managers' experiment My blog from a few years ago about the NER approach My colleague Karin Tenelius' blog where she also interviewed Xavier about the new ways of working movement in Spain Related Leadermorphosis podcast episodes: Ep. 53 Dunia Reverter and Jabi Salcedo talk about the NER / K2K approach Ep. 60 Anna Thomson and David Baksh talk about La Fageda

May 21, 2024Episode 9557 min

Ep. 95 Tamila Gresham and Simon Mont from Harmonize on new ways of seeing, being and working together

The way groups are working together is not working. But introducing new structures alone is not enough. Tamila and Simon talk to me about how we need to develop our ways of seeing, being and working together if we want to act in the highest possible alignment with our vision. A key part of this is using the lens of Power, Belonging and Justice (PBJ) and strengthening our muscle in Conflict Resilience. Strap in for some powerful wisdom, giggles and deep learning. Harmonize is a worker-owned cooperative that helps groups work together through Comprehensive Organizational Development and Analysis (CODA™). Tamila and Simon are the co-founders of Harmonize. Resources: Harmonize's website Harmonize's courses Simon's blog series on the Common Mistakes in Self-Management And his article 'Autopsy of a Failed Holacracy' Related Leadermorphosis podcast episodes: Ep. 19 with Simon Mont back in 2018 Ep. 33 with Margaret Wheatley Ep. 37 with Miki Kashtan