4 Real

Hosted by Dechert LLP

BusinessInterviews guests

Website RSS feed

Episodes

Latest episode

Apr 2026

Language

EN-US

About the show

4 Real is a podcast from Dechert LLP exploring the latest trends and developments in commercial real estate finance. Join co-hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert every month as they delve into current issues impacting both the legal and business aspects of real estate finance transactions, including lending, securitization and restructuring. Each episode features market commentary and interviews with industry thought leaders, providing listeners with valuable insights and practical advice, plus a little banter along the way. © 2026 Dechert LLP. All rights reserved. This information should not be considered as legal opinions on specific facts or as a substitute for legal counsel. It is provided by Dechert LLP as a general informational service and may be considered attorney advertising in some jurisdictions.

Listen to episodes

33 recent

April 23, 2026Episode 3356 min

Shifting Gears: The Forces Driving Insurance Risk in Commercial Real Estate

What if the insurance program you thought was protecting your deal is actually what's putting it at risk? In this episode of our 4 Real podcast, hosts Jon Gaynor, Sam Gilbert and Kate Mylod sit down with Emily Rasmussen, President and COO of Resilience Insurance Analytics, to break down what lenders, borrowers and attorneys need to know about property insurance in commercial real estate today. The hosts also explore the Basel III endgame re-proposal, and take a turn down memory lane to discuss childhood vehicles and names of their cars.

March 26, 2026Episode 3244 min

Calling Balls and Strikes: Batting it Around with Moody’s Dan Rubock

In this episode of Dechert 4 Real, hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert welcome Moody’s Ratings’ SVP and former Dechert lawyer Dan Rubock to the podcast for an in-depth look at his career shaping how the agency evaluates the legal architecture of CMBS deals. They also go extra innings on insurance risk, data centers, Canadian CMBS and AI, and share some favorite sports memories.

February 23, 2026Episode 3132 min

More Than Data Centers: AI Governance, Liability and the Future of CRE

Artificial intelligence is everywhere, but aren’t the implications for commercial real estate limited to data centers? In this episode, 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert sit down with Dechert litigation counsel Wilfred T. Beaye, Jr. for the AI breakdown that every CRE decision-maker needs to hear, including where AI can be most powerful, why governance is lagging behind development, which property classes will be most impacted and how companies can protect themselves from liability.

January 27, 2026Episode 3036 min

Five Key Themes From CREFC Miami 2026

Which CRE discussions energized the record-breaking and decidedly optimistic attendees at this year’s CREFC Conference in Miami? In this special edition of Dechert’s 4 Real podcast, Matt Armstrong, Jon Gaynor, Sam Gilbert, Stewart McQueen and Kate Mylod dive into the overall mood of the conference – which signaled resilience in the market despite geopolitical risks – as well as property performance, the issuance outlook for 2026, the continued rise of data centers, how private credit is filling gaps where banks and public markets are constrained and more.

December 16, 2025Episode 2931 min

'Tis the Season for Rated Funds

In our final episode for 2025, Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert are joined by corporate partner Ross MacConnell for an inside look on rated funds and their intersection with commercial real estate. Plus, we get into the 411 on the New York LLC Transparency Act and share our favorite holiday movies.

November 24, 2025Episode 2836 min

Giving Thanks for Transitional Lending

In our 28th episode, Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Kate Mylod sit down with Richard Flohr of CrossHarbor Capital Partners for a discussion on all things transitional lending, including construction financing and Richard’s passion for industrial CRE. Plus, Dechert partner Mauricio España stops by with the 411 on recent cases involving Western Alliance and Zions Bank, and the group gets “4 Real” about Thanksgiving day Turkey Trots.

October 23, 2025Episode 2742 min

Multifamily Bridge Loans, CRE CLOs and Pancake REMICs

What’s driving the robust and very competitive transitional multifamily real estate market? In this episode of 4 Real, hosts Jon Gaynor and Matt Armstrong highlight changes and emerging opportunities in this market with Russell Avery, Managing Director at Limekiln Real Estate Investment Management and Head of Capital Markets for their MF1 joint venture with Berkshire. The conversation explores the surge in construction-takeout and bridge-to-bridge loans, competitive dynamics between bank warehouses and CRE CLOs, as well as capital market trends like spread compression, term-out facilities at the end of a CLO life and repo financing. Plus, Dechert tax partner Will Cejudo breaks down Pancake REMICs, an innovative tax structuring tool poised to reshape deal execution across CRE finance. Show Notes Dechert Develops REMIC Structure for Longer Investment Periods (“Pancake REMIC"), Dechert OnPoint (September 15, 2025)

September 11, 2025Episode 2627 min

Parsing Private Credit in Commercial Real Estate With Missy Dolski and Jim Dunbar of Värde Partners

How does fund finance fit into leading investment firms’ broader lending strategies? In this edition of Dechert’s 4 Real podcast, hosts Jon Gaynor and Stewart McQueen sit down with Missy Dolski and Jim Dunbar of Värde Partners to discuss the launch of Värde’s new fund finance platform, CRE CLO collapses, areas of distress in real estate, issuance trends, opportunities on the horizon and much more. Plus, Jon and Stewart share the 411 on the recent data center boom.Show NotesThe Download on Data Centers, U.S. Election Ripple Effects and Disney Vacations, Dechert 4 Real (Oct. 29, 2024)

August 19, 2025Episode 2527 min

The Return of Real Estate M&A and Upcoming EDGAR Next Changes

What is driving the uptick in real estate M&A activity? Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert sit down with global finance partner Justin Gdula to discuss the mechanics of real estate-backed M&A transactions, the factors that led to their resurgence, the challenges lenders and borrowers face in navigating these complex deals and the critical elements that ensure successful closings. Plus, Dechert associate John Ludwig-Eagan gives the 411 on the SEC’s EDGAR system revamp coming in September.Show Notes:EDGAR Next: What Filers Need to Know and How They Can Prepare, Dechert OnPoint (March 11, 2025)U.S. SEC EDGAR Next Enrollment FAQ

June 24, 2025Episode 2435 min

CREFC Countdown: Five Biggest Takeaways From the New York Conference

Has a “bullishly measured” commercial real estate outlook for 2025 become “cautiously fatigued”? Dechert 4 Real’s Matt Armstrong, Jon Gaynor, Stewart McQueen and Kate Mylod rank the 5 biggest takeaways from this year’s CREFC Annual Conference in New York, ranging from the vibe shift since January’s conference in Miami, the uncertainty the CRE market is currently processing, repo trends, GSEs using AI to root out mortgage fraud and more. Show Notes CREFC 2025 Annual Conference - Full Agenda